Visiting a local Bangkok market

 

Catching a local video blog that included descriptions of a local market visit reminded me to take some extra pictures of a recent stop at one.  Here it's a lot like taking pictures in a grocery store, just not the kind of thing that comes up.  Instead of filling in general background explanation I'll let the pictures and descriptions of what was there tell that story, leaning a bit towards fruits and deserts since those are of interest to me.  We go to grocery stores a lot more often but I like the slightly different selection at local places.

My mother-in-law, Mama Nid, buying a lunch for me, fried pork, Northern-style sausage, and sticky rice (or glutinous rice, if you must).  We normally get fried chicken here but it was sold out.  That sausage form is really nice, dry in texture with a lot of herbs added, and a spicy edge to it.

The sidewalk right outside that inner market area, essentially the same place.  The umbrellas protect against the rain in the rainy season and sun in the hot season.  It rained that day, even though it really should be hot and dry now.

Fruit!  Pomelo or Asian grapefruit is similar but a little different (foreground), with two kinds of mangos, a small version of orange, peanuts (fresh boiled or steamed), apple and Asian pear, and what I think is a hybrid fruit from plum and mango, but that may not be right.  There are a lot of different versions of banana here too.

That fruit that looks like a plum and mango hybrid, kind of a rough looking version here, selling for 80 baht ($2.60 or so) per kilogram.

One of the main types of mango, used to make mango and sticky rice.  They're nice but sweetness stands out more than other flavors, with just a bit of citrus to it, so not as interesting as some other versions.

Mango and sticky rice, a version with coconut milk mixed in as it's eaten with mango.  This shop sells different Thai versions of custards too, and the more colorful deserts are coconut based dishes closest to jelly, but not that.

Pumpkin and custard go together a lot better than it sounds.  We bought pumpkin elsewhere, just without custard, which I'll have for lunch today along with corn (sold as fresh-steamed sweet corn still on the cob), sticky rice, and left over pork ribs from that first shop photo.   The yellow items are sweetened shredded coconut and something vaguely like a custard made from coconut, but not that, a sweetened and thickened egg yolk instead.

There were vegetables there but even the ones with no US equivalents aren't as interesting as the fruits and snacks.

Ready to eat curries and such typically cost about 30 baht, $1, for a small amount like this.  Most dishes are eaten with a plain steamed jasmine rice.

Curries and an egg and tofu dish.

Fresh seafood, sitting out in trays or pans, with ice added to keep it cool.

Mama Nid again, buying that sticky rice, to go with mangos we already have at home.  I'm not sure why but no one in my family eats much fruit, except for me.  Kalani eats some.

The back part of the market is dry goods instead, clothes and whatever else.

Jasmine wrist leighs, used as offerings to local deities at small altars or else as car air fresheners.  The smell is really intense; I hate being in a taxi that has one of those in it.  One of these would be intense for adding fragrance to a whole house, at a cost of 20 baht or so (60 cents), or maybe only 10, depending on the source and design.

Back to a desert theme; these look like tacos but they're sweet, some with a savory and salty component.  The yellow part is sweetened shredded coconut, and the white part like marshmallow.  They're good.  That blogger I mentioned walked around a market saying how amazing everything was, and then you think really, or is that just him being amazed by the novelty and range?  Thinking it through I think the fruits, vegetables, prepared foods, and deserts are kind of exceptional, so if it's just bias for him it also applies to me.

Candied versions of something I don't recognize.  I eat most of the fruits and snacks I've shown, but not these, typically.

On the strange side, I think this is a liquer-like tasting fruit (salaya?) mixed with pepper, but that's really a guess, since I've never eaten that.  That fruit is nice on it's own, but it's really spiky, so hard to open without getting stabbed.  I didn't see a photo of one but I can look it up from old pictures:

That's it.  It works to use a butter knife and a napkin to open those without pulling the spiked back out of your fingers.

What that market looks like from across the street; we walked over to get noodles at another shop.

Of course there really are tuk-tuks around.

That noodle shop, kind of how those tend to look.  You can pick from a rice-noodle based version thinner than linguine (more or less standard), and thicker and thinner rice noodle versions, and then one or more wheat based noodles, or what they call ma-ma, ramen noodles.  The white balls are usually fish balls, but a pork version looks the same.

At that shop.  She is so nice that it's great going on that kind of outing with her.

An odd looking tree bark, and a good place to park a small bike.

Fried fish being sold on a sidewalk table.  That price range is $1 to $5, converted.

I've been eating a lot of what Americans call Mandarin oranges for weeks, the version on the left, which Thais call Chinese oranges.

An equivalent to a mortar and pestle, used for mulling spices in Western cooking, is used to make raw papaya salad and other Thai dishes.  The metal item is a Korean style barbecue device (a cheap aluminum version of one); you put burning coals in that and then meat on top, with the rim tray making a broth you can cook vegetables in.  It works really well, or at least thicker steel versions tend to.  The upper left is a version of a charcoal based "stove," I think.  It's not so uncommon to see street food cooking using wood as the fuel.

A shop selling a lot of bright plastic pails and tiny stools, and coolers and such.

A local shop selling a lot of random stuff, like an old version of a hardware store, kind of, except that most of it isn't hardware.  What looks like tennis racquets are electronic devices that swat and kill mosquitos, like a hand operated bug zapper.

Another way local markets look, a picture I saw looking up one other, here with Mama Nid a few years younger, in shorter hair.  The picture is too blurry to really make it out but the foreground is a mix of meat paste cooked into a form not familiar in Western food, served in banana leaf.  It's good, just hard to describe.

When I first arrived here the smell in those sorts of markets was really intense, both positive and negative, but hard to take.  Now I tend to not notice any smell, since it's all just normal background.  Wearing a mask must counter some of that too.

Monsoon Thai coconut and mango-sticky rice black teas

I made it to a new Bangkok (Asok) branch of Monsoon Tea shops I'd been meaning to visit just prior to the pandemic.  The chain is based out of Chiang Mai.  They sell flavored teas, with particular focus on "forest friendly" naturally grown versions, using old tea tree plant material from old forest areas.

I've met Kenneth a couple of times, the owner; he's nice, as the staff were very pleasant and helpful.  I'll leave the rest of the background as linking to parts of that tea experience.  The shop is nice, a bit off the main Asok area, where Terminal 21 is located, not so far from one of the main Bangkok red light areas, but definitely not close to it.  That part of town has a lot of Japanese influence; the Fuji grocery store not far from there, but really beside Phrom Pong station, is great, worth checking out.

For background this tea matches a coconut black tea from them I reviewed long ago (Christmas 2015; the time just flies), and I've tried a Dhara white and Choaphrya River fruit flavored oolong since, all of which were great.  In turning up those links I was reminded that oolong was from an Assamica plant type; interesting.  That would match up with the old-plant local-source theme.

that tea had reminded me of Christmas, and it was Christmas time, so it really worked

trying an oolong there; the quality was good, the style just wasn't a preference match for me

Thai coconut black tea review:

In looking at the brewed tea it's not uniformly oxidized or mostly oxidized, as black tea often is.  There's no need to be concerned the tea won't be good based only on appearance, because brewing it and trying it tells that story.  Inconsistent oxidation or lower levels of oxidation could work out really well, if the inputs just happen to work out that way.  Or maybe not.  But only the brewed results tell that story, not leaf appearance.

Upon trying it I wouldn't say that the tea is good.  The balance is unusual when I first taste it, and given in what sense I can't imagine that could shift.  It's interesting, and novel, but slightly sour, and that flavor aspect stands out most.  The version I had tried years back was a conventional black tea, relatively fully oxidized, with a very positive and balanced contribution from the coconut flavor.  It was like coconut in a Mounds bar, really sweet with a slight toasted edge.  The coconut flavor is hard to pick up in this, although it is there.

I'll often not review teas I don't like, and this is right around that threshold.  It's interesting, and pleasant in a sense, it's just not really "good tea," with a lot of room for improvement.  The input of the leaf not being fully oxidized, or at least mostly so, probably isn't helping this tea.


That brings me to the second reason I would review a tea, if it wasn't to talk about what I like about it, for the novelty in style being interesting.  This is novel on a few levels, for being a flavored tea, for being from Thailand, as a follow-up to one of the best flavored tea versions I've ever tried.  And for considering how varying levels of oxidation in black teas works out, which turns out to be overshadowed in this version by a different concern.  I'm probably judging this more negatively because it's not nearly as good as that earlier version, or at least related to how I remember it. 

Next relationship to a vendor comes into play.  I really like Kenneth (the owner), and want to support his business, and Thai tea development in general, and the "forest friendly" theme.  I don't blindly buy in but I accept there's something completely valid there, especially as a long-term direction that food production really needs to go in.  A long term transition like sustainable food production needs to start with initial steps, and there would be positive and negative parts to the early development, aspects or forms that work better than others. 

Back to this tea, sourness isn't normal; that's typically seen as a processing flaw, that a tea stayed too moist after the final drying stage, and picked up that flavor later on, after it was finished.  This being partly oxidized could pair with that, but of course white or green teas are also left unoxidized when dried, and need to complete a drying cycle to be stored properly.  Finished moisture content and oxidation level don't necessarily link together.

All the same there is promise in this tea's character; some parts work.  To the extent I can pick it up the coconut is positive, again a very pleasant flavor addition version.  It's a shame it's not an addition to a better tea version, that this picked up the sourness that it did. 

When first brewing it I had considered that results might be more positive if I used less tea and moved away from my normal Western practice of brewing three infusions, versus two longer ones.  I'm guessing but I'm probably using 5 or 6 grams of tea to produce just over 250 ml (one cup) of brewed tea, infused for about 3 minutes.  I'm not using completely hot water since the thick ceramic cup took away a lot of the initial heat, and the water was a little off full boiling point to begin with.  For some what all that means is clear, and it would be hard to break it down fully if not, how proportion, water temperature, and timing tend to map together.

I'm using a hybrid approach, really; true Western brewing would back that off to 2 1/2 to 3 grams infused for 4 to 5 minutes, using a second longer round (so maybe 4 at first, then 5).  For a flavored tea the concern is that the first round "rinses off" the flavor; obvious enough, right?  For this coconut being too strong isn't the issue, it's that sourness.  It's conceivable that the coconut flavor input wasn't right, that it "went off" slightly for some reason, and it's that I'm tasting, not a flaw in the processed tea leaves.  But it probably just wasn't dry enough.


I tried an oolong version at the shop that I didn't like as well, something atypical, which I think was their highest end version (selling for the most, something with "forest" in the title, maybe).  It wasn't flawed tea; that was a style issue, about personal preference, not matching any range I like.   That was selling for such a high per-gram price that I would've had harder feelings about buying a significant quantity of that, where this coconut tea was pretty reasonable, something like 280 baht per 50 grams, or $9 for that much tea.  That's still a lot for a flavored tea, about double a more typical outlet price.  That's another part I wanted to address here, how sources and types affect pricing levels.

You can't compare the pricing with a market standard when there are no other options for the type.  These teas are unique; there are no alternatives out there like them.  That's just as well for this coconut black tea, and the oolong that I didn't like, but the Chaophrya Blend tropical flavored oolong I just reviewed was really novel and positive, as were those other two.

Cost also relates to supporting a local physical shop.  Pricing is usually higher in brick and mortar shops versus online outlets; their overhead is higher.  And I'm fine with that.  If you don't support your local tea shop it won't be there for you later (in general; if enough people don't).  It feels a little unnatural buying tea for twice as much as I could spend through a separate outlet, if there are equivalent options out there, but in some cases I'll do just that.  When a tea type isn't available elsewhere that's just what that type happens to cost.

For local Bangkok Chinatown shops all that doesn't apply; their overhead is low, because they're out there in Chinatown, where rents are low.  They cover their overhead through volume sales, not tea enthusiasts dropping buy to pick up 200 grams.  I just visited my favorite shop right after making these notes and bought 400 grams of tea (4 tuochas of 2012 Xiaguan sheng puer) and 3 small porcelain gaiwans for a bit less than these 200 grams of flavored teas.  It's much better and more interesting tea, per my preference, and it cost less than half as much.  Getting there towards completely aged Xiaguan sheng wouldn't be for everyone though; it tastes a bit like tobacco, a little on the earthy side, quite intense in an unusual sense.

with Kittichai at Jip Eu, from a few days ago

my wife was my driver that day so she finally met those shop owners (she's on the left)

I'm still suggesting that Monsoon teas are worth trying; diverse experience is a big part of what makes drinking tea so interesting, and these teas (the others) are unlike any other types I've tried, positive in novel ways.  If spending 1600 baht ($45--what I paid for 200 grams) throws off your tea budget then if you live in Bangkok go to Chinatown instead.  Just be careful there, because teas are even less consistent if you just visit random shops.  Even in my favorite shop, Jip Eu, quality level, styles, and relative value varies a lot.

Monsoon sets pricing lower as you buy in larger volume amounts.  Of course if you don't like a tea that's a bad thing, "getting through" half a kilo of one.  Tasting teas in the shop would be the easy way to avoid that.


The second round is much better; sourness is much diminished.  This is quite pleasant.  Maybe the coconut oil had "went off" somehow; that would explain how the rinsing function improved it.  For drinking this as a sequence of Gongfu style rounds it might have worked well, throwing out the first two infusions and then enjoying the rest.  It's a bit faded in character, and coconut barely comes through, but the balance is still pleasant.

Intensity being faded makes it hard to review.  It tastes like good black tea and coconut; that's it.  It's not as strong as the Mounds / Bounty bar effect in the one I tried years ago, but it contributes in a positive way.  There's a trace of sourness but after finishing half that first cup, and throwing away the rest, it seems to not even be present in comparison, at this level. 

Now I'm closer to recommending this tea, but I'd stop short of that.  The concept works, and the execution has positive merits, but that one flaw makes it not worth it.  Drank as this round it's entirely positive, for what you do experience, but not very intense.

Mango and sticky rice black tea

definitely fully oxidized, going by dry leaf appearance

Blogger didn't save the notes I made for this so I'll finally achieve a short review version, related to re-producing the notes from memory.  I liked the tea.  The type is a reference to an herb tasting a little like sticky rice, with more on that effect and input related to a Laos white tea version here.


It wasn't bright in character as one might expect from the name and description.  The mango aspect seemed more like dried mango, or really as close to dried apricot, which is close enough.  Sticky rice effect is contributed by an herb that really does taste a bit like sticky rice, and that part worked.  I would have expected this to be brighter, sweeter, and more intense like the Chao Phyra oolong version I reviewed not so long ago was.  Of course light oolong is a different thing than a black tea; those are going to be warmer in tone, expressing a less "bright" flavor range.


That description reconstruction:

-seemingly good black tea; no flaws, no pronounced astringency, decent complexity.

-the second infusion gave up a bit of intensity but both were quite pleasant, and a third was still good too, just dropping out quite a bit of intensity.

-anyone looking to re-create the effect of a mango and sticky rice desert wouldn't experience that, but the balance and complexity are good.  Sweetness wasn't as notable as it could've been, and it didn't seem like they tried to add the coconut sauce flavor aspect part.  The bright citrus note in the one type of mango used to make the sticky rice desert wasn't in this version either.

-flavor range was good and the balance worked well, but both intensity and complexity could've been better.  Some plain black teas I've tried in the past have seemed to surpass this across a lot of that range.  Mixing the tea and two other flavor inputs probably made it seems a bit non-distinct, compared to a really good black tea where all the flavor is a natural input.


This might have worked really, really well with a touch of coconut, based on a flavorful and fruity version of white tea.  But that's asking a lot, getting all that to balance.

Next steps:

I have a plain black tea and oolong I bought yet to try; I'll see how those work out.  Given that I didn't like either of these as much as that earlier flavored oolong (Chao Phrya blend) eventually I might stop back to buy some of that.  I keep giving tea to our "family monk" and I think he would really like it.

Kenneth will be presenting at an online conference, the Nomad Tea Festival, a theme the pandemic helped originate (or at least expand on, but I don't remember those turning up in the exact same form before).   That's at 1:30 - 2 AM local Australia time on July 26 (seemingly with scheduling set to make sense in the US instead; just make sure you get the date right if you plan to watch it, since it's often "tomorrow" already here). 

That's at 10:30-11 at night here; I'll be out of town for the weekend but still might catch it.  I suppose there's a decent chance they will make the videos available later if you miss it.