2006 Xiaguan FT Te Ji sheng pu'er tuocha

 

On a recent visit to my favorite local Bangkok Chinatown shop, Jip Eu, the owner, Kittichai, gave me a Xiaguan tuocha.  They'll often pass on a sample of something interesting, but I don't remember them giving me that much tea like that (100 grams; not so much, but a significant amount).  It's very kind of him.  I suppose it's partly in thanks for me writing here about them, and steering some business there, which to me is about helping others find decent tea, not really about benefitting me.  I typically mention other shop options as well, as I did in the last post, discussing how Sen Xing Fa--another nearby shop--is set up better for doing extensive tasting.

I probably found what it was, more or less by chance.  A King Tea Mall listing looks exactly the same, down to all the numbers listed, and Chinese text (as far as I can tell).  Of course there is also Google Lens translation, but that helps less than one might imagine.  It's probably this:

2006 XiaGuan "FT-Te Ji" (Special Grade) Tuo 100g Puerh Sheng Cha Raw Tea

Listing for $26 for a 100 gram tuocha there.  That probably is market rate now.  You can buy the newer ones, that need another 15 or 20 years to age more, for more like $10, but someone holding onto it to cover that part costs you, with varying storage conditions inputs giving different results.  Then it's probably also an above average quality version, outlined in detail by that King Tea Mall listing:

Description:

The 2006 XiaGuan "FT-Te Ji" Tuo is part of the esteemed "Te Ji" series, denoting "Special Grade" in Chinese. This line of Puerh Sheng Cha, initiated in 2003 by XiaGuan, aimed to exceed the quality standards set by the JiaJi tuo cha. Renowned as "TeTuo" ("特沱"), an abbreviation of "TeJiTuoCha," this series underwent an official renaming in 2016, underscoring its prestige.

Distinctive Features:

The wrapper bears the trademark design of a "Pine tree and Crane," emblematic of the series' heritage and superior quality.

Variants of the "Te Ji" series include the general version and a higher-quality variant distinguished by a red-eyed crane.

The "FT" (Fly to Taiwan) version employs slightly superior tea materials, featuring more young buds and tiny leaves.

I had thought FT stood for "for Taiwan," but that doesn't change much either way.  This shop, Jip Eu, doesn't carry this tea anymore, per my understanding since they've sold out of a large batch they would've bought back in 2006 or so.  I do keep buying another 2012 Xiaguan tuo version there, which they still sell.

Review:

first infusion (after a rinse):  flavors are nice, subdued, clean (as this range of tea goes), interesting and pleasant.  The distinctive flavor that reminds me of aged horse saddle leather is there.  Harsh edges have largely aged off it, in those 19 years.  That would have to do with the hot and humid storage here; that wouldn't be true of the exact same tea stored in a cool and dry area.  

second infusion:  feel is thick, oily, and viscous.  I really do like that odd earthy range of flavors, especially in a version that's closer to ready to drink than I usually try.  I re-tried a 2012 Xiaguan tuo (from Jip Eu, the one that they still do sell) over the past week and it's close enough to enjoy, but not this far along for fermentation transition.  Beyond the leather--or at least what I interpret as leather--there is good depth of other range, mineral content, towards medicinal dried herb, and a little towards dried longan or tamarind fruit, it's just not overly fruity.  Feel is pleasant and the overall effect isn't harsh at all.

third infusion:  it reminds me a little of smoke, brewed a little stronger.  Often if a tea has contacted smoke that input will come out strongest right away, and keep fading.  This might well just be a natural related flavor, which does kind of match with the rest.  I'm not sure if this is a positive transition or not, related to my own experience just now.  I'm open to teas tasting like smoke, natural (inherent) or added, and it does match the other barnyard scope, but it's not necessarily better for including it.  Or worse either, as I see it, so just different.

fourth infusion:  quite balanced at this level; everything I've mentioned is still going on.  It's got decent intensity, of course.  I'm brewing this using a moderate infusion proportion too, for me, maybe only 7 grams in 100 ml gaiwan, versus the more typical 9 or so (typical for me).  Mind you not everyone would like this; to others it could be harsh, or off-putting.  The 2012 was more so, with so much of the earlier rough edges standing out.  I had my daughter Kalani taste it, and to her it was awful.  She asked why anyone would drink that.  I liked that version too (yesterday, I guess it was), but it wasn't quite ready, maybe by those extra 6 years.

her, posing

It's hot as Hades here, trying this tea in Bangkok at noon.  I should at least turn a fan on, but I've not even done that.  It was so nice living in Honolulu where the temperature is between 75 and 80 F all the time, maybe 25 to 28 C, and now it's back to 30s / around 90 F all the time.

fifth infusion:  the complex balance of flavors keeps shifting, the proportion, but the range isn't changing.  Smoke isn't gone but it was only a main flavor input for that one infusion.  Sweetness is nice for this; to me that one input helps tie all the rest together.  Feel is nice, and intensity, and aftertaste expression.  Layers of leather, barnyard flavor, medicinal herb, and some dried fruit really complement each other.  But only for people who like aged Xiaguan, of course, and it's hard to imagine someone preferring newish, untransitioned versions.

sixth infusion:  not different.  I might even drop taking notes here.  There probably will be some degree of interesting change as this wraps up, around infusions 10 to 12, or it could be pleasant and interesting up to 15 rounds or so.  Intensity is high enough for this that I'm using short infusion timing, 5 seconds or so, which will enable it lasting longer than if I was soaking it for longer.

Seeing a Tiger Balm pack of balm on the table reminds me how someone might interpret this as including quite a bit of camphor.  I suppose that it does, as people use that term.  I've never been completely comfortable isolating that as a description very often, but it's there.  Food range makes more sense to me; you get chances to eat those things, and it associates more naturally as a flavor.  Something like smoke is familiar enough from foods that this connection often makes sense too.  

Then I just can't remember specific floral ranges or incense spices.  Maybe this tastes a lot like one of them, and I wouldn't know.  Interpreting it as including incense spice would make sense too, but it would be helpful to be familiar with a half dozen of those, to break it down to that next level.

seventh infusion, comparison tasting with a Dayi (8582):  I was re-trying a standard Dayi cake with breakfast, not to see if it was ready, because it wouldn't be, from 2016 (9 years old).  It's pretty far along for spending that time here in Bangkok, but it needs at least another half dozen years, and it will level off closer to where it will be in another 10.  I keep trying the teas to see the transition patterns, because they're interesting.  It's not even about education or learning, it's just interesting.

The Dayi tea is harsher; it's not there yet for age transition.  It includes a green wood component, and a harsher form of astringency.  This is much better than it was two years ago when I first bought it (reviewed here then), becoming more pleasant.  Positive warm-toned flavors are developing.  

It's interesting how that "barnyard" range stands out in the Xiaguan.  It's not just that it's further along for transition, and it is that; the basic flavor range is also different.  There's a nice sappy effect that goes along with that, crossing over from flavor to feel.  I'm not sure what I expected this comparison to highlight.  The flavor and other character differences are interesting, but not informative.  It was sitting on the table beside me doing the tasting, so it seemed as well to try both and mention it.

This stopped short of guessing where the Xiaguan stands in terms of being relatively fully age transitioned, fermented, or how it might change over some of the following years.  19 years of transition in Bangkok storage is a lot, but it will keep changing over the next decade, probably mostly for the better.  It's definitely not going to run out of intensity.  Most of the green wood type flavor range and harsh-edged feel is gone, so it's fine to drink now, but it might still be a good bit better later.  I'd have to try it in another half dozen years to know.  I suppose that I probably will mostly set it aside to see.

Benchmark reference:  Liquid Proust now carries a similar Xiaguan tuo

I remembered seeing a mention of a Liquid Proust (vendor) Xiaguan tuo of about the same age, and that will help set what a market rate is for this.  Here is his listing:

2006 Xiaguan FT7653-6 100g, THB 1,016.95 (around $30)

Out of all the storage I've had there was always the Yang Qing Hao and Wistaria house notes that couldn't be rivaled. Then comes along this 2006 Xiaguan random tuo that has been pushed in warm and humid conditions in Taiwan. The depth of the tea with the smoke notes that are matured into something new with the puerh... it's a treat that I will miss dearly. This might be one of those extremely lucky finds.

Per the comments it's the aging conditions that give the tea great value, and the one Hong Kong shop that James of Tea DB keeps mentioning, Yee On tea, carries something similar for about double that cost, so $60.  

So market value is somewhere between $30 and 60?  That's a good bit for a Xiaguan tuo.  Next one would need to compare storage inputs to determine if the one I've just reviewed is really as good, or better, and personal preference would enter in so much in making that determination that it really wouldn't work, as an objective finding.

Thai minor deity tea cups, in the MBK mall; something different

Visiting my favorite Bangkok Chinatown shop; on Bangkok pu'er storage

visiting with Huyen and Seth earlier this year

This must copy a few other posts, since every time I get back to Bangkok after a break I check back in with the owners at Jip Eu.  I just did that again.  I'll cover what we tried here, and go back through how shopping there would work for others, framed as advice.

  

There are some interesting strengths and drawbacks for those traditional kinds of local shops.  Pricing is much better than most outlets, even for online sales, for all but the most value-oriented or producer-direct sources.  Range of products is inconsistent but good; they carry a lot of tea.  But then it's not set up as a place to try lots of teas, not as a tourist destination, as Sen Xing Fa is (another nearby shop).  So dropping by to taste tea with them for an hour isn't the conventional visit form; you usually just go there to buy tea.

When you are their friend it's different, and the visit can be more social, instead of only related to tea shopping.  To me they're like visiting family.  As an expat here, a foreigner, those kinds of connections mean a lot, because I'm not as socially connected in friends groups as I normally would be back in the US.  When we stay in Honolulu, where I just got back from, I do things with my daughter's friends' families, and talk to neighbors, or occasionally do things with them.  Here I talk to local shop owners, but that's about it.  Even work colleagues are separated by a cultural divide, and we don't end up socializing much.

So when I dropped by Kittichai, the owner, was happy to share an interesting black tea he picked up traveling back in Wuyishan.  He has family in Wuyishan, Anxi, and Hong Kong, so he's pretty well networked for tea related travel, and sourcing.  He has a friend who makes tea in Bing Dao, Yunnan, as well, so it isn't limited to those places.

that black tea

Of course Wuyishan is better known for twisted style oolong, for Wuyi Yancha, rock oolong teas (Da Hong Pao, Rou Gui, Shui Xian, Qi Dan, Bei Dou, and so on).  But oolong related cultivars often make really good black tea.  It's probably seen as a waste to use the material for that, since good oolong might sell for more.  Exceptional, novel black teas are really pleasant though, as this one was.

It will hard to convey tasting notes; I focused in more on catching up, on hearing how they were doing, what they'd been up to.  And they asked about my kids, and Hawaii, and we talked about tea themes, about market patterns back in China.  They said that Wuyishan tea demand remains strong, since the supply is limited, but that pu'er supply has probably overextended demand, so that especially for factory tea versions demand and sales are flat.  

So it would be a great time to buy a lot of volume of mid-range pu'er, except that you'd need to either be in Yunnan, closely connected to a wholesale vendor, or good with using Taobao to do that.  It would be all but impossible, for most people.  I just saw in online discussion that Farmerleaf actually dropped higher end cake pricing, since that higher quality range of material now costs them less too.  That was for $120 to $150 cakes.

Back to that tea, it included the typical exceptional flavors, a warm mineral base, pronounced mid-range (again I've lost track of flavor characteristics though; maybe like an aromatic spice, a bit off seeming like a rich dried fruit), great feel, and good character over many rounds.  He said that brewing it using a slightly lower proportion works well, 4 or 5 grams per the standard 100 ml gaiwan, using slightly longer infusion timing than for sheng or oolong.  It was just perfect, the way he prepared it.  It was very refined.  It's all but impossible to find black tea in this general range, and since the type and style was sort of a one-off it's even more impossible to find that.

Does he even sell it though?  Probably not.  Often I'll try what he finds that is interesting to him there, his own tea.  Then in other cases it actually is for sale.  Another customer came in to find specific things and we looked over a high end chrysanthemum version and two types of Longjing, that he actually does sell.  One of those was pretty far up the scale for Longjing character and quality, about as good as they ever get, and it would really be worth $1 a gram, if you could buy it for that.  I can't afford that, due to wasting money moving back and forth around the planet.  The more moderate range Longjing also seemed pretty good, from just smelling dried leaf, but I didn't buy it either.  I drink sheng, and also buy black tea sometimes, but I'm in a cycle now where I'm drinking through what I already have.

Again I don't really remember the pricing or availability, for those green teas.  I think I'd asked, but I wasn't making notes, and I was focused on visiting.

A tangent about trying aged sheng, and about other aging patterns

Then we tried a 1999 Chang Tai sheng pu'er cake, which he definitely doesn't sell (although he did; this is the last of a large batch he sold most of years ago).  It was pretty good.  I can't appreciate aged sheng as much as others who are on that page.  I've bought three versions from them (Jip Eu), so I own three of their cakes, a purple label Dayi (from 2004 or 2005), and a Xiaguan 8653, and Zhong Cha / CNNP red mark cake from around that age range.  20 years is a good age range for drinking those styles of sheng, or 18 is even ok, maybe just not quite there yet.  That 26 year old cake had levelled off to where it was going to be.  I've drank enough of both the Dayi and Xiaguan that I'm on the second cake of each now, or really mostly just holding onto them, to see how they keep changing.

I've been trying some of my other older cakes and noticing how interesting aging patterns play out, strengths and limitations.  Today--when I started this draft, at least--I tried a CNNP / Zhong Cha cake I bought at Sen Xing Fa, that was kind of good but also a bit iffy, maybe from sometime in the 2000s (I could look that up; I reviewed it here).  It's much better now.  Some early round funkiness has aged off it, and depth and flavor character is great.  It's better than it should be, based on how it was a half dozen years ago.

Then two other versions I've recently tried ran in a different direction, more or less dying.  One was a boutique style cake from Tea Mania, one of my favorite online tea sources.  It lost so much intensity it seems it will probably just disappear later, and it's probably only a 2017 or 18 or so cake, so not all that old yet.  Someone might bring up the "teen-years" in-between aging forms issue, that it could rebound, but it's really going to fade to next to nothing.  The style wasn't right for aging; I could tell that earlier on.  But I bought two cakes to see, and one is long since drank, and now I have the other to keep trying over many years.  

Another was an inexpensive factory version from Chawang Shop, an earlier favorite online source.  It shifted to taste like wood, a common enough unfavorable aging pattern.  When you buy a cake for a very low price you kind of expect limited potential, and it's interesting seeing how that works out in different cases, over time.  They sell plenty of exceptional tea, that would hold up well to 15 or 20 years of transition time, this just wasn't one of those.  The better teas I bought from them as smaller cake versions, 100 or 150 grams each, so they're essentially all gone now.  I bought Xiaguan mini-cakes and small Kokang Myanmar sheng for long aging from them, and both aren't ready yet, over a decade old but not even close.  

Today--at time of revising the draft, anyway--I re-tried a white label cake that I have no idea of the type, origin, or age of, that's actually quite good, aging well, and in a good place.

I wouldn't say that the Chang Tai version had the greatest potential, or had landed in an ideal place, but it was slightly better than most of the other versions I'm describing (maybe not the last I mentioned, but it might need 6 or 7 more years to be in a related place for fermentation input).  I really like that rough, barnyard flavors oriented Xiaguan 8653 character though, but that's a personal preference, not something that would apply to everyone, and definitely not a statement about general quality level. 

visiting them years ago, with friends I now miss

Back to the visit

I bought inexpensive Wuyi Yancha (Shui Xian) to give away to local monks, who can't shop for tea on their own.  It's not the most indulgent gift they would tend to get, that moderate quality tea.  But it's nice to drink sometimes, as medium quality rolled style oolongs can be.  It's hard for me to appreciate or remember to mix in other tea experiences, as a sheng drinker, but when I do it still works.

an earlier (2022) version of the same kind of Shui Xian blend, from them

what that 2022 version looked like.  blend versions vary, but one was exceptional once.

Kittichai gave me a Xiaguan tuo when I left.  It was a bit much, sharing those exceptional teas with me, and giving me some, but again I see them as friends first and a tea source after that, or a bit like family.  That shop is a great place to pick up an extra Xiaguan tuo.  I think the ones I usually keep buying are from 2012, not quite there yet for aging input, but pretty close, and you can see how that part is coming together.  This one was from 2008, something he sold most of earlier on, I think, so I don't think that you can buy it.  Maybe I'll write about it, comparing it to others; I have a half dozen different Xiaguan versions around, or maybe more, counting cakes, and it's been awhile since I've been through a review.

2006 and 2012 tuochas, reviewed here, with the 2012 from Jip eu

those 11 and 17 year old Xiaguan tuo versions (that aged back then, in 2023)

The range of what they carry that you can buy is still ridiculously broad.  They carry a lot of tin based teas that are good value, like the best of what you'd stumble across in a Chinatown market shop back in the US, if you were luckier than ever tends to happen.  It's a great place to buy things like Dan Cong or jasmine pearl white tea.  Upper medium quality, moderate cost Dan Cong is a strange thing to run across anywhere.  Probably most vendors pass on that same quality range as exceptional, leading to the mistaken convention that Dan Cong should include a lot of characteristic astringency.  Better versions aren't like that, and the couple I've tried from Jip Eu weren't harsh, requiring careful, fast brewing to be approachable.

I'd already mentioned some sheng pu'er range, but they really specialize in Wuyi Yancha.  They sell a lot of inexpensive blended Shui Xian versions, like the one I bought, but they carry much better and more interesting versions.  A standard pricing range for the higher end range is 1000 baht for 100 grams, $30 or so, which is pretty good value for teas as good as they tend to be.  Styles and cultivars used would vary; they don't sell those in a limited style range, as can occur.  When they do carry versions from within the restricted park area in Wuyishan those are pretty good, but that extra demand factor makes them a less favorable value, even though quality level and style tend to be more consistent and positive inputs in such a case.

They don't sell everything that a US Chinese market would carry, but then those tend to not carry much for really good tea either.  They don't sell the little dried mandarin orange peels stuffed with pu'er, and there aren't large-jar stored teas to choose from.  They keep their teas in sealed packaging, with better versions in 100 gram versions, ready to sell.  The inexpensive versions, like I bought, either come in sealed bags inside custom printed boxes or else just in folded paper, made into a brick or bar shape, the old-style presentation.

The random stuff they have around that they don't sell is an even more interesting range, but people would never see it, unless you tend to be a regular visitor, a friend, and then you might.  When I first visited there they were drinking an aged green tea from the 70s, of course which they wouldn't have been selling.  Kittichai must have lots of aged sheng that he sometimes drinks but doesn't sell.  He likes oolongs better, and those can be nice with a few years of aging, but in general they're not so different beyond after a year of rest.  High roast level versions are an exception; those might keep improving with multiple years of aging, as that input fades and balances.

More advice about shopping there

The main obstacle is walking into that shop, or others, and hearing "what are you looking for, what kind of tea do you like?"  For some people that's an easy question, and they'd mention the one or more main types and styles.  Plenty of others would like whatever is especially interesting or novel, and are open to exploring.  That question could be hard to answer.

It can help knowing what a shop specializes in, what tends to be exceptional there.  I've already covered that in this writing, but I can summarize it further here:

-inexpensive, modest quality Wuyi Yancha, Shui Xian (what I bought, what Da Hong Pao often really is); this might cost around 100 baht ($3) for 100 grams

-much better quality Wuyi Yancha (twisted style Fujian oolong); this often costs 1000 baht ($30) for 100 grams

-a range of tin based medium quality teas:  Dan Cong, jasmine green, jasmine white tea, some plain greens.  Cost would vary by quality level and demand, but they would be in the middle, more like 5 or 600 baht per 100 grams ($20).  For lower quality tea that's too much, but for true medium range that's a good find.

-aged sheng pu'er:  there isn't too much, but the exceptions are fantastic.  Some 2005 or so cakes are worth considering (Xiaguan, Dayi, CNNP), and inexpensive Xiaguan and Tulin tuochas are a good find.

-fresh Longjing and Tie Guan Yin:  market rates push these to often be a bit pricey, beyond the range of most of what I've described.  Good TGY is different than the stuff that costs almost nothing, and is everywhere.  It's not worth it to me, because I'm not mainly an oolong drinker now, but for others on that page that trade-off is familiar ground.

-Thai teas:  there isn't much; this is a Chinese tea shop.  You could still ask if there is something, but I'm listing this to clarify that it's not their main range.

-black tea:  how could a Chinatown shop not carry this?  The range would keep varying though.  I've tried great Lapsang Souchong from there, the unsmoked type, and pretty good Jin Jun Mei (just not in the most standard form of that), and they may sell that Wuyishan version I described trying.  What they offer would keep changing, but it wouldn't be a difficult discussion to sort through.

-exceptions:  I once asked them if they sell pressed white tea cakes, and they said sure, and produced an aged buds-only version, that I bought for a special gift.  There are probably another dozen or two exceptions around, or more; it couldn't hurt to ask about something unusual, if it's of interest.

-teaware:  they don't specialize in this, but they have some Yixing around, of course with the product certifications, and I keep buying inexpensive white, porcelain gaiwans there.

Shop storage issues

Kind of an afterthought, but some people would be looking for this, as a main consideration.  If they do sell older sheng, as they do, what is the storage input like, tying back to conditions?

It's hot AF in Bangkok, and I think that plays in as much as the high humidity.  Teas might be closest to Malaysian storage input.  They were just telling me that Hong Kong storage seems more humid to them, the shop owners, and that teas from there pick up an off taste, a funkiness, like dirt or peat.  It's considerably cooler and even a bit drier there, in HK, so I think this relates to shops there managing storage to achieve specific outcomes, like fast aging, and heavy resulting flavor range.

To me tea stored in that shop (in their storage area) picks up a certain mustiness, that typically fades over a month or two after you get it.  I don't think that relates to Bangkok climate, I think it's about a lot of tea being stored in an enclosed, hot space.  To me it's familiar and favorable, but it's funny how people tend to prefer whatever they become accustomed to.  People who love Hong Kong or Taiwan storage explored ranges early on and happened to find good versions from those places, and then that character range, how teas tend to transition there, became familiar to them.  

Over and over you see "separated at birth" comparison stories of cakes being stored in two places, with the friends sharing them each preferring their own local range version.  Kunming vendors saying they like dry storage input seem to be obviously conducting marketing, not telling the truth, but it's possible that teas not changing much, and transitioning slowly, is what they come to prefer.  Probably not for Xiaguan tuos, which need 30 years to get there under those circumstances, or maybe 40, but for other types losing the freshness and brighter range so fast could really seem negative.  It's odd to me encountering freshness and brighter range in a 10 year old tea, and that can happen, but you get what I'm saying:  varying starting points would give best results with varying storage related inputs, and a general preference could tip in different directions.

This input can make it hard to judge what you buy from Jip Eu, or other places.  A month of rest wouldn't typically settle out all of that somewhat negative input.  After two months you'd know what you have.  If they have a broken up or last bit of a cake out to taste with you of course that's something else entirely; that has already went through this airing out process.

One might wonder if a cake shouldn't taste good pulled directly out of storage; is there any reason why slightly musty storage input is a good thing?  I'd be guessing in answering that.  I will say that aging cakes by giving them ample air contact is probably a bad thing; that would kill them, over time.  Maybe the optimum trade-off does involve less than optimum results straight off the storage area shelf.  If you pull a cake out of a basement, or a cave, and it tastes like it had been in such a place that's something else; I'm not talking about that.  

This is one of those odd discussions where people who already know exactly what I'm saying would fully get it, and others would need to go try a dozen cakes to get it to map to personal experience.  I'm not saying that Bangkok storage, and Jip Eu's in particular, is good or bad, I'm saying that it depends on preference, and it's good in one way and bad in another.  I think that the more fragrant, delicate, less challenging cakes I have would transition slightly better in cooler and dryer storage, just slower.  I think that for something like a Xiaguan tuocha or Dayi 7542 you need to get it all moving, to appreciate the tea before 25 years pass, and hot and humid storage input could easily be regarded as better.  Moderate but considerable mustiness from storage involving no air exchange at all is probably negative.  Going into that storage space more often might already be enough air exchange, opening and closing the entry door more than a couple of times a month.

This isn't headed towards even more conclusions; that's pretty much all that I had to cover.

Teas from my favorite Bangkok Chinatown shop; about meetups

 

meeting the Jip Eu owner, Kittichai, with those friends today

Later today, at time of first writing a draft, I plan to visit my favorite Chinatown tea shop for the second week in a row, Jip Eu, meeting friends there.  Last week I met Huyen and Seth there, and it was just great, as always.  The owners feel like family, and we always drink lots of teas and talk about their background.  

Kittichai, the owner, has half a century of experience in vending and producing tea, since the family shop is something like 80 years old, and he's from a tea producing family in China.  That last time Seth could even talk to him in Mandarin, which seemed to work a little better than English, which also works.  We tried a black tea I brought then, Thai tea in a Dian Hong style, and from them Lapsang Souchong (a great, high quality unsmoked version), and an Anxi black tea, and maybe one more I'm forgetting.  We usually try a sheng pu'er, or some oolong, and probably did then.

Of course I'm not saying that everyone would typically have the same kind of experience there.  They wouldn't.  They're not set up to sit and try sample after sample of tea with visitors, as shops more oriented towards tourist visitors might be, like Sen Xing Fa.  Value is better for what they sell though; that staff support level and extra expense gets built back into pricing.  Everything always gets built back into pricing; if a vendor offers free shipping that's not exactly free, and if you see a lot of marketing for a vendor, or if packaging is elaborate, you're the one paying for that, in the end.  

In Jip Eu they would be happy to discuss teas and offer options, just not typically tasting tea after tea, instead whatever they have open.  Sen Xing Fa sells some of their teas from large jar storage, which is not really ideal, but it does help with keeping sample portions available.

Jip Eu specializes in low-medium quality Wuyi Yancha sales, Shui Xian blends, what people tend to call Da Hong Pao in other places.  Then they also carry really nice Wuyi Yancha, and lots of other range.  I bought pretty good jasmine pearl white tea the last time, a gift for monks I know.  I'd drink that too, but I'm more a sheng pu'er drinker, so I'd get to it slowly.  I have a tin of jasmine green tea at home that I'll finish within the next few years, at this rate.

I bought decent Dan Cong today, again for monks I know.  They can't buy tea for themselves, and no one else knows about the theme to include it with offerings, so I'll periodically give them some tea.  One monk just helped us organize a memorial service for a cousin who passed on a few months ago, and another taught Keoni and Kalani meditation last summer when they were here; they play an active role in our lives.

The sheng range in Jip Eu is limited but it's a great place to pick up a Xiaguan tuo, or even a well-aged Xiaguan cake.  I try different teas every time I'm in there so it's hard to keep track of all that they sell, maybe even for them.  These teas I'm reviewing aren't necessarily indicative of that range, beyond the likelihood that quality level and character is a bit random.  Some of what they sell is quite good, and a good value, but since it all varies it helps to be careful and selective there.  I've tried their 100 gram folded paper packs of Shui Xian that were great before, well above average, and bought lots for gifts just then, but the last versions I bought were back in the range one would expect, pretty decent, but not unusually good.

I'll include a review of two of their teas, samples, and then add a section about the outings there at the end, framed around photos.  The owner mentioned that they sell online through Shoppee now, of course with product range much more limited on that online shop.  Something like the Dan Cong version I bought would be on there (the one in the hexagonal shaped box).  I've bought a couple of tins of their Dan Cong before, when I was doing more with oolong, so I'm confident that it's quite good as tea sold in that way goes.

Review:

Jin Guan Yin rock tea:  interesting!  We just tried a well-roasted, fall harvest, Taiwanese rolled oolong at a gathering with friends a few days ago, and this is pretty similar.  Roast level comes across first, but that's a much different experience than with Wuyi Yancha, where well-roasted tea tastes a bit charred.  This integrates.  It has vegetal undertones too; this isn't highly oxidized oolong, still at a moderate level.  

The final effect is pleasant; it balances.  There's a nutty sort of range, which I'll probably describe differently as rounds pass.  It could also be interpreted as bread-like, towards fresh sourdough or homemade bread.

Tie Guan Yin (I'm pretty sure it was that):  it's interesting how that general style theme, low-medium oxidation and high-medium roast, come together for a similar style but different result.  There's more floral range in this, but it's possible that the oxidation level is slightly higher, since part of the tone is warmer.  

The other version must express some floral range, it's just not evolving clearly early on.  In this it really comes across.  Thickness and fullness is also nice, especially for this being a fast early round.  This should have pretty good intensity and balance, I'd expect.

JGY #2:  even more intense roasted oriented aspects emerge.  Then it's a little odd how that contrasts with a "greener" base of flavors, but this is one typical style of roasted oolong that comes up.  I might like versions that balance higher oxidation input better, but that's preference oriented, not objectively better.  Maybe that would be a common preference.  

Some spice range seems to emerge, it's just hard to identify.  I think underlying floral tone is a part of this too, and mineral base.  There's a good bit going on.  Balance is fine, it could just integrate slightly better, related to that opposition between oxidation and roast level I mentioned, only an opposition if someone sees it that way.  That Taiwanese oolong example was pretty similar (the one we had tried at a recent tasting); again this is one conventional style.

TGY:  richer, creamier, fuller, more balanced, and more floral.  I'd imagine a lot of people would like this more, and I do.  It's interesting how creamy this is; that tends to be associated with Jin Xuan (a cultivar and oolong type).  It's both a flavor and feel input.  It includes some of the same warm roast range as the other version, but it balances better with the rest.  Tones are slightly warmer, even though that's not clear from the aspect labels I've mentioned (floral, versus spice range / towards fresh bread).  

JGY #3:  I'm going to cut this short, since I'm running late for an appointment to meet friends.  They are part of that new set of friends from a meetup with Seth and Huyen.  I brewed this round much stronger, distracted by a phone call, but that can help with identifying some parts of the character.

It's still pleasant brewed on the strong side.  Roast input really hits, and the rest picks up a lot of thickness, a much fuller feel.  Mineral is quite intense but not unpleasant.  There are no flaws that make this objectionable.  People may not like this character form, the way these aspects balance, but that's not the same thing.  An inky flavor emerges from the strong roast, towards mineral, also towards the char that can come up in Wuyi Yancha.  But it stops short of tasting like char; this is an upper-medium level roast, for sure, but not really high level.  

It's pretty good tea; the quality level and expressed character is fine.  It's just that people would divide over how they take this style.  That's true of every tea type, but maybe all the more so for this.

TGY:  this is also pleasant brewed strong.  It's nice how oolongs give you that leeway, that you can brew them quite light or quite strong, and it's down to your preference which is better, but they don't become harsh.  Shou pu'er is like that.  Sheng pu'er isn't; if you brewed any remotely young version this strong you'd have to dilute it.  I tend to do that by brewing a flash infusion and mixing them, not adding water, but it's not so different.

The balance is nice in this.  That roast input connects better with other warmer tone range, and the floral input, and mineral depth.  Greater thickness of feel shifts the overall experience, it's just not related to flavor balance.  Somehow the inky sort of flavor, between mineral and char, doesn't apply to this, even though the roast level is similar.  I think that's from how light vegetal flavor is offset by incrementally higher roast level in the other (both are upper-medium, but that level is a little higher).

JGY, #4:  brewed lighter, to see how that changes things, in the middle of a transition curve.  It comes across as much sweeter; it's better.  It's still intense and full, so it just balances better.  That slightly aggressive roast level is tapering off, letting the rest fall into a more natural balance.  It wasn't completely out of balance before, but this is better.  This matches what Tea Mania had sought out as a relatively good version of Taiwanese roasted oolong (the one I tried with friends); it's pretty good, as quality level goes.  Some of my reservations about style are resolved as well, as this transitions to be better balanced.

TGY:  also sweeter and lighter, but that roast edge still comes across clearly.  Overall effect is quite pleasant.  The aspects I keep describing work well together.  This is a little better than Thai versions of rolled oolongs ever tend to be, although surely some are this good now.  It's clean, well balanced, rich in feel, with good sweetness, and a positive flavor balance.  Warm floral range stands out most, then mineral base, and warm tones, towards spice, but not like Rou Gui or Oriental Beauty expressing oolong.  It's more an incense spice, like sandalwood.  It's nice.

These are far from finished but I'm off to meet people in Chinatown now, in this shop.

Recent meetups:

So many!  I'll skip the two I've already covered in posts, meeting Huyen and Seth at their tea tasting, and at a local Central World mall tea sales pop-up market, and touch on the rest, by commenting on photos.  The point will be the experience, aspects that make them interesting, in ways others could also explore, but of course the personal connections were the best part.  

I mentioned visiting that shop today, but I didn't mention what we tried:  an old Mengku sheng pu'er, a younger Xigui version (which I had reviewed here), Rou Gui (rock oolong / Wuyi Yancha), a medium roast level Anxi Tie Guan Yin oolong, and Thai and Vietnamese sheng versions I brought for comparison.  I was a little underwhelmed by the Thai and Vietnamese teas; the Thai version had a green tea edge, and the Vietnamese one was ok, more like sheng, but not as catchy as it might be in relation to expressing positive flavor aspects.  It was good, but not great, and not overly interesting.

I had mentioned this shop visit before, with Huyen and Seth

tea meetup at home

I might add a little about what we tried at home, in that more medium sized gathering.  We started with two of my favorite teas from Aphiwat, a Thai producer, a Thai version of sheng and Dian Hong style tea.  That was about sharing my favorites, and it matched a staggered start time, letting people running earlier try those.  We later also tried a Hong Tai Chang sheng from 2005 or so, that Thai producer that related to Chinese producers making tea here (but that back-story might include some mythology at this point).  And a Taiwanese more-roasted but lightly oxidized oolong, the one I compared these teas to.  We also tried a benchmark version of Xiaguan cake, maybe from 2006, and finally a Lao Ban Zhang sheng pu'er version, something I don't re-try very often.

It's never enough, until it's too much, and we didn't quite there in the time we had.  It can be nice trying teas in a mapped-out way that makes sense, working from lighter to heavier, exploring styles in a planned way, maybe moving from more basic to more refined range, but just trying what people find interesting in no particular order can be nice too.

There isn't much for "lessons learned" related to having friends over, or visiting that Chinatown shop.  It's asking a lot of shop owners to just host a tasting, basically, but if you know them they're often pretty flexible about that.  Of course it's only reasonable to buy some tea at the end.  Beyond giving tea to monks I can always stock up on an extra Xiaguan tuo, or the like.

It was interesting brewing tea for 8 people, all those versions, in the one gathering.  I used a larger sized gaiwan, 200 ml, maybe, and combined or "stacked" multiple infusions to pour decent sized cups.  It's nice having small, comfortable cups for that purpose, like these:

I'll probably take it easy with the tea meetups for a week or two; it's been hectic.  The current air pollution problem in Bangkok has caused our cat to lose her voice, so I've added a trip to the vet to these tea meetups, and a memorial service outing.  That was visually interesting too:

another temple area; there is so much to see there, in Wat Pho

a nice teaware display in that temple

Jip Eu Lao Banzhang and Xigui sheng compared with Moychay LBZ

Jip Eu Xigui left, then JE LBZ middle, and Moychay version right, in all photos

I visited my favorite local Bangkok Chinatown shop over a month ago now, before visiting the US, to pick up some basic Shui Xian for gifts "back home."  The owner, Kittichai, gave me some coins of what look to be interesting sheng pu'er.  His description of what they are:

This tea is the product that the shop sells. It is raw Pu-erh tea. There are 4 production sources: 1. Laobanzhang, 2. Xigui, 3. Pingdao, 4. Yiwu (ripe Pu-erh). It is produced by Si Da Ming Pu Company, which is a factory owned by relatives.

They were #1 and 2 of those, the LBZ and Xigui.  

Given how LBZ works out the next question that arises is always "is it real?"  There is a narrower village area, what LBZ is really supposed to mean, and then the common claim is that much of what is presented as such is really from a larger area, so related but not exactly the same.  I'm not accusing that shop or this tea of it not being legitimate; I can't really weigh in on source location issues like that.  Which brings up how one might even begin to guess about that origin issue, or weigh any evidence.

it would've been cool if the tiny discs had age stamps on the labels

I've tried a number of LBZ versions, or teas presented as such, maybe a half dozen or so, or at least 4 or 5; it's hard to keep track.  I just noticed that I had some from Moychay LBZ from a few years back, a 2020 version, so I can compare the versions.  Of course one version being aged longer changes everything, and it's not as if teas from those narrow source areas are necessarily all completely identical.  Every year micro-climate issues change the harvest, and very local growing conditions factor in, along with processing, and there should be some variation in plant ages and type.

Trying three teas together would be a lot, but I do like to lean into combined tastings to keep these multi-part reviews moving along.  I'll do it!

I'll be skipping the part about referencing vendor product listings, because I don't have access to any.  The Jip Eu tea is sold by a Bangkok shop, and I didn't do an extensive search to see if I could find this online, but that's unlikely anyway.  I looked up the old review I wrote for this Moychay LBZ version (here), but it didn't reference a product link.  The post said that one was up but it didn't have pricing details yet; I really should've referenced it anyway, back then, in case it might still work now.  That review mentioned a lot of fruit, and of course it's on to warmer tones now, almost four years later.  The time just flies.

I never did get a production age from Jip Eu until after I tried these.  They're from 2018, so two years older than the Moychay version (2020), aged 6 years now, or maybe 6 1/2, depending on when they were made.  It was interesting considering that during the tasting, because it's not at all clear from the character.  They seem significantly aged, but not fully aged, and there is a lot of space for potential age in between a couple years old and a decade.

Review:

Jip Eu Xigui:  a little light; I didn't really try to stretch out a first infusion time enough to make this more conventional.  It works well getting a limited first impression then really starting on round 2.  

This will be good.  Complex floral tones already show through, supported by warmer range.  This almost has to be a good bit older than half a year old, this year's tea, judging from that character.  And from the brewed liquid color; both are too dark.  At an early guess this is probably better than the average sheng I try, maybe even some versions presented as exceptional.  There's a faint hint of smoke.  I'll do more of a list description next round.

Jip Eu Lao Banzhang:  in a sense forward flavors are less pronounced, but a richness and depth comes through better than for the first version already.  Again this just can't be a 2024 tea, or a whole section would be needed to discuss how that kind of anomaly could even occur, but I can't guess how old it is yet.  This is also clearly very exceptional tea, even based on getting a limited early impression.  Floral range is pleasant, and there's lots more going on with it.  Warm mineral depth is nice, positively supporting the rest, and feel is already positive.

Moychay Lao Banzhang:  this is going to hold its own with the other two, at the least; it is also exceptional.  It might be getting a slightly faster start for being maocha initially, for opening up and brewing faster, related to never having been compressed.  For this being a 2020 tea it has transitioned a good bit; early fresh, bright flavors have evolved to become pleasantly complex warmer tones, with an awful lot going on.  It has a pleasant fruitiness, which I'll describe more as I go.

For sure it's not possible to buy this tea, and hasn't been for years.  It's a shame; I can see why adding significant spending to tea sourcing to set away versions like this for mixed lengths of time would add a lot to tea experience.  If this had been a relatively costly (but perhaps still reasonable) $3 / gram setting aside an extra 50 grams would cost more than a standard boutique produced cake, as long as it wasn't gushu.  Along the way the same sourcing issue would come up; is it real?  It's quite good, but I never could definitively guess about origin location claims, even for more mundane source concerns.

JE Xigui #2:  these should be brewing just fine, on to guessing about infusion time for less material than I usually brew, maybe about 5 grams.  I'll err on the long side this round, just in case, and go close to 30 seconds.

There's a bit of smoke in this, pronounced enough that you can't miss it, but not overpowering.  There was a hint in the aroma the first round but you couldn't taste it as clearly; here you can.  It's strong enough that it's a main flavor input, so that does change things, so that someone's feeling about that input would determine the entire experience.  I don't mind it, but it's hard to see it as positive, an improvement.  Beyond that the rest is fine, some mixed floral range, good supporting mineral, and other harder to isolate warmer tones.  It may need to drop out over more rounds to enable a clearer interpretation of the rest.  

The smokiness tastes like wood fire smoke, like a fireplace that's empty but that has been used a lot.

Jip Eu LBZ:  as I interpret this it's in a place where initial brighter floral range is well along in transitioning to warmer tones, to spice range and such, with warm mineral replacing what was probably earlier on lighter mineral.  I don't think it's at the teenage-years threshold character where versions tend to not make sense, not fully switched over, but kind of showing gaps where the change hasn't filled in yet.  But it's not like a young / new sheng either; early sweet, light, bright range is well along with transitioning.  

Storage conditions varying so much related to changes makes it hard to guess the age.  7 or 8 years of dry storage can be comparable to just 3 or 4 in a warm, humid place, even if the changes aren't exactly the same.  It's not as if it's the same changes at a certain distance down a linear path.

Feel is quite pleasant, the way that full, warm mineral tones join a full, rich feel that seems related.  Bitterness is still present, but not much of it.  What is still there transitions nicely to sweetness after you drink it (funny how I never mention hui gan here; it's that).

Moychay LBZ:  that's so nice!  There's so much fruit present, in a very interesting and positive range.  A little dryness and bitterness offsets it, and there is plenty of warm mineral tone too, but one part of the flavor range is really interesting, complex, warm dried fruit.  This may not be a fair trial for the Jip Eu versions, if this has aged longer, and the extra couple of years has allowed it to evolve this depth and complexity.  Or it could be that varying storage inputs make that an uneven input, or that changes in initial form and potential mean the teas never would seem similar, even with the same storage input and amount of storage time to change them.

The warm dried fruit might be along the line of dried longan, but a root spice tone stands out just as much, as you try to break it down, towards sassafras.  The warmth and character range is reminiscent of cinnamon, it's just not a close match for flavor for that.  The fruit tone, or tones, I think people would interpret in different ways.  Dried longan is just a place-holder to give a clearer impression; really it's complex.  

Jip Eu Xigui #3:  I'm really feeling these teas already; that's the obvious drawback of trying a three way comparison.  I've already drank some water and ate a few nuts between these rounds; kind of early for resorting to that.

The smoke flavor might be settling out already in this, but it's still there.  It will probably take one more round to describe the rest better, which would work better if the smoke input happens to clear up.  I went with a fast infusion this round, no longer than 10 seconds, and that doesn't help the rest stand out more.

Jip Eu LBZ:  this is really good, quite exceptional.  It doesn't help it that the next version I'm comparing it to will be that much more complex and intense, across really interesting scope.  The two do overlap a little in basic flavor; dried fruit, with some floral range that's more in the background in the other that stands out in this.  The warmer tone range is comparable, mixing with other spice range.  

It may be that this isn't as transitioned as the other, so it's in a different place, back on floral versus fruit, not settled into warmer tone range yet.  It's good, and it's complex, but compared to the other it might seem a little muted.  It can't really be the "in-between" timing and fermentation transition concern; no matter how young or old these are this seems slightly less fermentation-transitioned than the other four year old version.  

Fall material versions can come across as less intense; an input like that might come into play.  That's also one way that LBZ material can turn up in remotely accessible or affordable forms, along with origin being just a little outside that narrower village area range, or from somewhere else entirely.

Moychay LBZ:  warmth and depth picks up in this; it's different trying it brewed this fast.  This may "brew out" relatively quickly, given how fast it got started, and that I'm not using that much leaf for this, maybe about 5 grams, or it could even be 4.

This is much more whole-leaf compared to the other two versions.  That should reduce astringency in this version, and increase it in the others (relatively), muting intensity a little in this, and adding more challenging aspect range to the others.  They're all pretty approachable though; that makes me think the other two must not be very young material, along with the flavor tones being warm, brewed leaf darkening some, and liquid color not being lighter.  

This Moychay version is quite dark in brewed liquid appearance, on the red side.  That's actually a little unfamiliar, a sheng of this age turning that red.  It's been here in Bangkok for some years (3?), and that pushes the pace of transition.  Still the brewed liquid color is reddish, not so far off how black teas appear, not just darkened, more gold or onto between golden and amber instead.

A bit more warm mineral tone and astringency edge seems to emerge, possibly a function of the infusion transition cycle, and also related to brewing this round faster.  It would seem odd if that was it's best flavor range already passed through, while the Xigui version is still dropping out an early smoke aspect.  I'll give all three between 15 and 20 seconds next round, to get back to a more conventional infusion strength (for me, I guess that I mean).

Xigui #4:  there is some darkened area on the wet leaves; that smoke seems to relate to char from the leaf actually being singed a little.  It may not drop out then, if it's not from smoke contact, instead from the leaf being slightly burned.

It's not dropping out.  There's good sweetness and pleasant aspect range beyond it, it's just harder for me to identify in that context.  This tea does seem to be good for quality level; feel is full and rich, and overall character is refined.  I suppose it would be complex floral tones that I'd be going on more about.  Complexity is probably pretty good too; there are layers of different aspects present.  If someone is fine with a touch of smoke, or even enjoys that, this could still seem exceptional.  

I can appreciate it as pleasant to drink but it's throwing off evaluating it related to it being a better than average quality sheng version, or related to describing other aspects in detail.

JE LBZ:  this is getting even better.  Richness is more intense; overall complexity and balance is better.  Intensity isn't necessarily a strength, but there's a lot going on, across a very positive range.  

Dried fruit mixes with other layers of aspects, or other range, making it harder to isolate.  That's along the line of dried mango, combining with limited warm floral range, warm mineral, and some spice tones.  Some bitterness and a rich feel, including a little dryness, adds to the overall complexity.  The final effect is pleasant, refined, and complex, just not necessarily as intense as it might be.

Moychay LBZ:  this is evolving, changing.  Dried fruit range is similar but different; spice range is just as pronounced, or even more so, but again it's changing.  Dried fruit had reminded me of dried longan, and a touch more savory edge is showing up in this, maybe shifting towards dried tamarind.  Spice range is different, in a way that's hard to describe.  

There's still a catchy set of complex, approachable flavors present, related to the earlier set.  Maybe a touch of warm menthol joins the rest, like a less edgy version of mint, or menthol.  Or camphor, plenty of people might move directly on to suggesting, given how standard interpretations go, but to me it's more like an extra hint of wintergreen mint.  

This definitely isn't fading yet; interesting transitions are still occurring.  Five rounds is so much tea though, 15 of these little cups; that might have to do.  I'll need another break just to get to that next round.

Xigui #5:  smoke input is lightening, balancing out a bit.  This is pretty good tea, evident in the layers of inputs, the complex flavors and rich feel.  It's funny how that one smoke input can really alter and redefine the rest.  As it is this is a good example of a pretty good tea, but a lot of distinctiveness drops out for natural focus shifting to that one aspect.

JE LBZ:  also a very pleasant, rich, complex, and refined tea.  It giving up range in terms of intensity and novel flavor inputs stands out a lot more in comparison with the other LBZ version; it would seem better without that comparison.  It'll be interesting to hear the age of this tea, to see how that input led to this result.

Moychay LBZ:  a little brighter, more complex and novel in flavor range, also warmer in a sense, with warm mineral tones and rich feel supporting the rest, and just as refined as the other.  It's hard to not conclude that it's better.  It may be fading just a little already, having spent a lot of early intensity relatively quickly.  

Something unusual seemed to have been happening with how this age-transitioned; it seems as much like it's slightly oxidized as it seems fermented.  The color is a part of that, it being reddish, but a warm tone range reminds me of black tea character.  Quite often that comes up in lower quality sheng that's not made properly, which doesn't have good aging potential, and ends up tasting woody before it's even fully aged.  This isn't like that.  It's exceptional, and aging to be just as pleasant as when young, just in a different novel character.

Maybe the hot and humid Bangkok conditions pushed it through a much faster transition cycle than 4 1/2 years would usually enable?  Maybe it being maocha enabled that to go even faster, so that this is as transitioned as 7 or 8 year old versions stored under different conditions would experience?  It's possible that tea stored in cool and dry conditions, tightly pressed, would change less in a decade, and that the form those changes would take would vary.  It's quite good as it is though, the main thing.  

It seems at least possible that this lost some 15 to 20 year cycle transition potential along the way, that it's not in the right place to keep improving for more than another decade as a result.  Only time would really tell.  It seems likely that the other LBZ version would fade over the next 3 or 4 years, in addition to changing to include more warm flavor tones.

Conclusions:

The missing input in those notes had been the age of the two two Jip Eu versions (produced by the Si Da Ming Pu Company; mentioned earlier in the description, but not something I've been repeating).  It's from 2018; it was two years older than the LBZ version used for comparison, 6 years old now.

It makes sense that it's a bit less intense, related to having more time to age-transition, but that wasn't necessarily completely evident in the other character.  Level of transition seems pretty comparable, in relation to markers like color of leaves, color of brewed liquid, and range of flavor tones, or maybe slightly less transitioned.  That's not so unusual; the tea was compressed instead, and probably spent a good bit of time in Yunnan, maybe essentially the whole time.  Bangkok climate changes tea fast.  

I've been running in 90+F / 30+C high humidity (70% or so) conditions lately (in Bangkok), and it only cools down to 90 F / 30 C in the evening.  It's not the rainy season but it rains sometimes, and it's crazy how humid it is at other times anyway.  It's hot and humid for tea and for people.

It's hard to place why the Jip Eu LBZ would be that much less intense, but it had good complexity and good positive character, so that only stood out as much in the direct comparison.  Maybe it was autumn harvest material; that would make a difference.  One thing I didn't emphasize much in the review description was that the broken leaf character of the two Jip Eu versions should have caused much higher astringency experience; that should've changed the feel, related to the other.  Maybe the extra aging time offset that, without causing other changes that made it seem significantly older (but then 2 more years isn't that much older).

I can't say anything about value related to these, since I don't know any pricing ranges, but I could guess a little about quality level.  For the Xigui that's problematic because to me a bit of smokey character defined that tea experience, and to me that's not really a conventional input for better teas, as it had been more normal quite awhile back, related to how sheng often was a decade ago.  

That leaves considering which of the LBZ versions seemed better.  I suppose the Moychay version did.  It was more whole leaf (not necessarily better taken alone, but that can tie to more positive aspects), and a bit more complex and intense, and both had comparable positive character.  It was favorable that the Moychay LBZ expressed a bit more dried fruit, more supporting spice range, and then either a little mint or camphor.

The Jip Eu LBZ was well worth experiencing though.  If it was selling for a moderate price, maybe even beyond $1 a gram, given how "moderate" can be relative, then it seems worth trying out.  

Things shift for me related to trying a pleasant 10 gram--or so; about that--coin of exceptional tea versus buying a 200 gram small cake of one.  $10 is good bit to spend on two tea sessions, but not much for trying exceptional tea (not that I know the pricing for these; I don't).  There's just absolutely no way I'd spend $200 on a 200 gram cake, of just about anything.  If I earned three times as much income and my son's upcoming college education expenses seemed more sorted out maybe, but as things stand spending $90 on a standard size cake is already plenty.

It was really nice trying these.  It leads me to think about how these are in comparison with the last two sets of pretty good sheng I've been trying, the last two reviews, but it's too much to go into.  Sheng can vary a lot in character, and be quite positive in different ways, for different reasons.  That Tea Mania Mengsong from last week's review was pretty good (a 2014, with lots of variation in probably aging changes and related character), but this Moychay LBZ is in a really nice place now, and it's that much more novel, setting aside simple pleasantness of aspects.

where I run; the lights make it nice

the view at work, with a screen adding a digital effect