A small version of a tea tasting meetup (in Bangkok)

 

This last tea tasting meetup was really more just having tea with a few friends, but to me the way it worked out was interesting.  We tried some really novel teas, since two friends from earlier meetups had just visited China and Vietnam, even spending time with Huyen and her family there (in Vietnam), and with Seth.  I'd probably be more envious of that second part than visiting a tea expo; her family is amazing.

Since the interesting teas were the thing I'll get straight to that, and skip most of the back-story and other details.  We just got kittens a few days ago; that factored in a lot, so I'll mention it in passing, but that's an example of what I just said that I'd skip.  The kittens were well received, and Kalani helped with them and joined part of it, which has just never worked out before, either kid taking part.

I'll explain at the end what themes this highlights, how different kinds of tasting themes can work in different ways.  You don't really need one continuous, well-established theme for a tasting.

from another tasting (I should keep in touch better, mostly mentioning gatherings in this group)

What we tried

The tasting (from memory; some of this will probably be a little off).

Tea Side Dong Fang Mei Ren white tea:  we started with a tea I've reviewed recently, a white tea version of Dong Fang Mei Ren from the main Thai specialty tea outlet.  It's really nice tea, pleasant and interesting, and in a novel style (especially for being from Thailand), so it seemed a good place to start.  It's bright, sweet, fruity, well-balanced, complex, and refined.

that Tea Side Dong Fang Mei Ren (left), and a Gui Fei (rolled bug-bitten oolong)

another Thai Dong Fang Mei Ren white:  then we tried another white version of Dong Fang Mei Ren from Thailand that Steve brought; amazing it worked out like that (from Wang Put Tan, maybe it was).  I thought that might have been Tea Side's source, but the two versions were different.  They overlapped, being the same tea type, but oxidation level and aspects weren't identical.  Both versions were exceptional.  Probably producers can learn from what others do, and I've first tried Thai DFMR (Oriental Beauty) versions nearly a decade ago, so the theme has been around.

osmanthus rolled light oolong:  then we tried a flavored tea, unless I'm missing one, an osmanthus rolled oolong.  Flavored oolongs can be nice when the flavoring is natural, and this one was pretty good, relatively speaking.  It doesn't match the best plain teas, or even well above average versions, but it can be interesting trying different range together like that.  It didn't highlight the most potential a flavored oolong can have but it was interesting for comparison, and a nice tea, just a bit basic.

Ya Shi Dan Cong:  then Steve shared a Ya Shi Dan Cong (duck shit) version they bought in China.  It wasn't presented as the highest quality level, most costly tea version, since it sold for a moderate price, but it was pretty good.  The style wasn't identical to most well-above average Ya Shi versions, but it was close enough, and the variation wasn't necessarily negative, it was just a little different.  The smooth, roundish floral range typical of those was floral in a different way, with a different kind of vegetal edge, but without harsh astringency that can come up in some versions.  

It was really nice, really drinkable, and easy to enjoy.  People speak as if "breakfast tea" means something clear, as if a drinkable, moderate quality, pleasant to repeat tea experience can stand out for this context, and this would work well for that.  Black tea is nice with breakfast, but I more often drink sheng pu'er; it just depends.

Vietnamese sheng:  having tried so much oolong it seemed about time to change it up, so we tried a more-oxidized Vietnamese sheng version, one of my favorite teas, even though it's very non-standard, and not exceptional in terms of matching any of the standard pu'er range.  I don't think it would be great for long-term aging, that the oxidation input would offset that, but it's two years old now, and is probably getting better.  It's hard to describe what "more oxidized sheng" is like, but I've written plenty of detailed reviews that cover it in lots of detail.  This review compares the 2023 and 2024 versions; it would get into those kinds of background contexts.

those two "Quang Tom" tea cake versions (so fruity, I can almost smell them)

2018 Xiaguan Reunion sheng pu'er:  then we tried another sheng, that Xiaguan Reunion 2018 tea ball I reviewed recently, I guess not so much because it made sense in a sequence as much as because I found it so interesting.  It's not ready yet, in terms of optimum aging, far from it, but it's interesting see where such teas had probably came from and were heading, and how pleasant they are just now.  The mustiness from the local storage I said would fade over a month or two is already pretty much gone, and it has just been 3 weeks.  It drinks much better than it had, but it's still not where it will be in even another half dozen years, when transition makes more sense, or a decade, when it's closer to a final form.

looks like a tuo, but it's half a kilogram

high roast level Thai rolled oolong:  we got back to oolong, trying a well-roasted version, again out of Thailand.  Roasting had sort of taken over the character, making it more one-dimensional than most of what we'd already covered.  If someone would love that one flavor range it could still seem great, but low level oxidation, higher roast input rolled oolong isn't a personal favorite.  

Producers or vendors who have tea around that's a year or two old and want to add more freshness or appeal to it are kind of stuck, it seems.  A light roast might help, or there's always flavoring to be considered, but in general the material is as good as it is, and that's hard to change.

medium quality, medium roast rolled oolong (probably from China):  then we tried another that wasn't so different for comparison, to see if the gaps in that Thai version were a quality issue, related to the material missing range, or how themes might shift.  This moderate quality version had more going on, and less roast input, so it was better, even though it was clearly kind of medium quality tea, nothing exceptional.  It had a bit of a woody flavor, versus floral tones or warmer cocoa range standing out, but that also leaned a bit towards spice, so it was nice.

Thai black tea, prepared as ground tea:  then we tried something really novel, a ground up black tea, out of Thailand, an experiment that was supposed to draw on a matcha theme to be used to make milk tea, I think it was.  It was pretty good.  It ended up working out as brewed dust instead of obtaining a matcha-like whisked (blended) thickness, but maybe it had potential to be prepared differently.  

It's possible that maxing out astringency input and getting it to brew faster and more completely for use as a milk tea could make sense, that brewing this form could be better in some way.  Or it's possible that it's just an experiment, and completely brewing a broken leaf version would work out similarly, or even better.

I may have missed one or two.  It was a lot to try, and took awhile.  It was fascinating trying such a broad range of teas, and great talking so much that at times we drifted well off the subject of tea, on to current events, our own life patterns, politics, and so on.  People into tea are surely familiar with that, how tea can support much more lively and diverse conversation than alcohol, under the right circumstances.  And having kittens and a child join made more sense with the tea, than if we had been getting drunk instead.

So what is the point of sharing this?  Bragging?  Recommending that others get together with people they know, or don't know, and try lots of teas together?  To me it's that last part.  People into tea seem to often be pretty nice, and when others can appreciate a broad range then all of you being fascinated by lots of what is experienced really adds to a gathering.  

It can work mixing a lot of types of experiences together, with sub-themes mostly linking two or three versions, then moving on to the next range.  If you want to experience the most of a higher quality, refined form then it could be better to dial in focus and pay more attention, drinking teas that are similar in a sequence that makes sense.  But for a visit that divides focus on discussion and trying lots of tea range the other way can be good too.  

It can be interesting trying a tea with a novel flaw, just to see what that is like (trying one with storage flavor input contamination comes to mind, white tea probably stored near laundry soap), but of course then you wouldn't brew it for very many infusions, and in some cases might want to discard a rinse, if that frames it better.

It was especially interesting hearing about what a Chinese tea expo is like, and shops in a tea area in China, and how exploring tea in Vietnam went.  I feel like I'd be speaking for someone else telling a lot of their story in summarizing that though, and the ideas covered so much ground I would miss parts, or screw up framing.  It sounded like a real high water mark tea experience, the kinds of things I've never done myself (both of those broad themes).  I've seen markets in different places, and tea plants growing in a few, but it was never like that.

I'll sample a single interesting idea just to show what I'm leaving out.  They said that in China now no one pays with cash (not so unusual, I guess), and that you need to have WeChat payment capacity set up, or other local apps a foreigner wouldn't have, and that this one step was a bit tricky to clear.  It worked for them, so it wasn't a huge hurdle, it was just interesting hearing about the final process.  People use payment apps in Thailand too, but they're usually good about accepting cash, and often accept credit cards if they don't take cash.

There were lots of other tangents that came up; it would take pages to capture even main parts.  It was nice touching on personal background and current events some too.  I've met them all a few times, just not together, so it was like catching up again, and adding meeting my kids and the kittens added some chaos and also an interesting extra dimension.

Kalani made shirts for them from a sock

wearing a hat (with some goat's milk spilled on me)

they sleep all piled together, at times looking like a yin-yang symbol

Eye with them (right); thanks to Ploy (left) for giving them to us

Legend of Tea 2024 Mengsong sheng pu'er

 

I'm reviewing a third tea from the Malaysian vendor I've covered not long ago, Legend of Tea.  These teas were sent for review (many thanks to them).

This theme is one I've been looking forward to, checking out a sheng pu'er version they sent.  I'm trying out reviewing it completely blind, only knowing that it's sheng, with all of the label in Chinese.  It's pretty good, but I'll let the review itself cover that.  Value is really good; I'll add more on that after I cite the vendor's description, following:

2024 Xiao Ba Wang Raw Puerh Tea

As a timeless classic from Legend of Tea, "Xiao Ba Wang" has upheld its reputation for 19 years by consistently selecting high-quality, cost-effective materials with good craftmanship to deliver premium tea at an affordable price for all to enjoy.

This year's Xiao Ba Wang is sourced from ecological tea trees in the high mountains of Mengsong Da Man Lü, this sheng Pu-erh boasts a fresh, sweet aroma complemented by the distinctive alpine forest fragrance. Its naturally refreshing profile is soft, sweet, and intricately layered, offering a gentle yet rich tea-drinking experience. Each sip reveals a long-lasting sweetness with a refreshing, full-bodied aroma that lingers delightfully.

This is listed at $25 for 200 grams, so it's moderately priced, on the low side for Western oriented in-house teas (under $50 for a standard 357 gram cake; you don't see that in the main Western outlets, unless it's for "factory tea," nothing of this general type).  

It's quite good for that price, the quality level (I try the teas before adding website content).  I'll say more about that in the review, and cite more about the listed vendor background here:

What is High Mountain Ecological Tea?

High mountain ecological tea is cultivated in pristine, pollution-free environments far from industrial influence. Grown at elevated altitudes in eco-friendly tea gardens, these tea trees thrive in an ideal natural setting, surrounded by year-round clouds and mist. The significant temperature difference between day and night enriches the tea leaves, producing a clear, sweet broth with a distinctive mountain flavor and lingering sweetness.

At first sip, the tea is sweet and soft, with a full-bodied aroma that unfolds in layers, delighting the senses and enriching the palate. The sweetness and smoothness spread gradually, leaving a deep, long-lasting impression in the throat. Xiao Ba Wang beautifully combines the freshness of nature with the warmth and precision of handmade craftsmanship, offering a unique balance of strength and softness that is truly unforgettable.

I take everything every vendor says with a grain of salt, but it would be nice if all of that were true.  The tea is good; you would expect positive results like that from this sort of source context.

Review:

#1:  a little light; that's how first infusions tend to go, when you don't stretch the timing to offset that, or use a rinse to speed that along.  So far it's nice.  Sweetness is still moderate; how that balances might be a main input to my own preference.  It's clean in presentation, no mustiness, off flavors, harsh astringency edge, and so on.  There is already some mineral tone coming out.  I'll save the flavor breakdown for the next round, but it seems nice, as if a few things will stand out, including some floral tone.

#2:  depth and complexity pick up.  Bitterness starts, but that's still moderate.  Mineral undertone is pronounced, of course in a light mineral range, nothing like in Wuyi Yancha or other roasted oolongs.  Flavor seems to include floral tones, and a creamy sort of feel is adjoined by a touch of creamy flavor.  Sounds like oolong range, doesn't it?  But the feel structure of this is sheng, and the included bitterness, even if it's not challenging.  

Warmer tones are hard to identify.  They could be interpreted as a savory edge, along the line of sundried tomato.  Or it could be interpreted as an herbal tone, even towards a green-wood edge, but to me more of a savory aspect that includes herbal range.  It's not exactly like pine, but not so far off that.

So what would this be, judging by just this?  Hard to say.  I don't have a catalog of distinct flavor profiles for broad and narrower Yunnan origins mapped out in my experiential memory.  It's not as smooth, floral, sweet, and "round" as Yiwu tends to be, but being approachable with some floral range it's not completely dis-similar.  The pine note reminds me of Jing Mai, but it's not clearly pine, to that same extent.  It's not edgy, intense, or challenging enough to be from standard larger areas like Menghai or Bulang (with intensity and complexity more the Menghai theme, and distinctive bitterness that could be paired with pleasant sweetness from Bulang).  So I don't know what it is, and probably won't.

#3:  bitterness ramps up a good bit; this is closer to where it's going to be, and may even lose some of the bitterness and challenging edge over a round or two.  But it's not really heavily astringent, or all that bitter, as more bitter versions tend to be.  That's significant, but it balances with the rest.  At this point it's the main part of the experience, so I mean balanced in the sense of still standing out most.

Sweetness isn't bad; it works.  I've become accustomed to fruity, approachable, complex South East Asian sheng versions, and this isn't that.  Aftertaste extends well beyond drinking the tea, and feel structure adds to complexity.  Flavor range isn't as distinctive as it might be.  Mineral tones stand out a lot, and some floral range, and an herbal / vegetal edge, more herbal than vegetal.  It's not unlike how ginseng root comes across; a bit vague, but also complex, with plenty going on.

#4:  more of the same; it isn't changing quickly.  Aftertaste and bitterness may both dial up slightly.  Intensity is definitely good, and again the balance and overall effect is nice, the lack of flaws.  Flavor range doesn't extend to anything so interesting, but it comes across as good tea, pleasant and intense.  

I think I'm feeling the effects already.  It just worked out that breakfast was light on carbohydrates (starch in particular), which seem to delay stomach processing of tea compounds, and protect from negative feel issues.  For me that's a good thing; I don't need to be getting stoned off tea.  But this seems to have significant effect, for people on that page.  

This may be a good quality version from an area known for being challenging, with this pronounced bitterness and feel structure only this approachable because it's whole-leaf material, and perhaps not low elevation / high fertilizer input grown.  People claim that older plant material has a greater depth to it, more mineral range, with extra aging potential, and that more wild origin material tends to pick up interesting flavor range from the environment, and to often be more approachable, while still complex, which could vary.  I suppose there's probably some truth to all that, it just doesn't help identify this tea.

#5:  still not evolving so much.  The earlier set of descriptions was already broad enough, and only the balance of the range mentioned keeps shifting.  Floral tone really isn't so pronounced, compared to the rest.  There might be some moderate fruit range evolving, along the line of grapefruit, probably a relatively sweet version of that.  Herbal / medicinal range stands out, but not as much as bitterness and the mineral base.  I'll look up what this is, out of curiosity, and leave off the notes here.  

I checked; it's from Mengsong, presented as high mountain, natural growth origin teas, maybe not forest tea, but from a diverse environment (as I interpret it; I've pasted most of the description there).  I've reviewed teas from Mengsong but again I don't memorize a matrix of origin-related character types well.  It is interesting how the flavor range I struggled with describing, saying it was a bit like pine, or maybe ginseng, possibly herbal or vegetal in some way, they describe as "distinctive mountain flavor."  That works.

Conclusions:

Just wonderful, for a tea presented as a moderately priced version (low, really, using Western outlet standards).  It's a throw-back to when Yunnan Sourcing was still trying to keep their Impressions series as a moderately priced offering.  Maybe they do release a modest quality version still, but last I checked most branded as such had moved on to higher quality, more distinctive specialization, and a higher price range, the typical $70 to 80 a cake that now represents the low end of in-house pricing.

Some of my reluctance to be open to that $80 to $140 current range is that I just don't have the budget to be buying and drinking that.  That's enough of an issue.  Then I also remember when the standard range for pretty much all cakes was $30 to 50, with some outlets pushing "white label" more exclusive pressings up closer to $1 a gram.  I tried some marketed as such, and never bought any.  To me buying a $100 tiny 100 gram cake is ridiculous.

Tea quality got better, over the last decade.  A middle of the range $100, 357 cake is now probably better than most of the range available a decade ago, or closer to that exclusive pressing version than factory teas, or the then-rarer in-house versions.  At the same time vendors working off a standard mark-up benefitted greatly from selling $120 cakes instead of $40 versions, so they embraced, or even led, the customer demand for better and better versions.  

"Gushu" was all selling for $1 a gram 5 years ago, when pricing was still going up.  Some surely was from older plant sources, but who knows, really.  Or from more natural growth gardens, as this is presented.  You could see from the pressed cake that chopped material had given way to more whole leaves, which is now more the standard form, outside of "factory tea" versions.

It's hard to place this version within the broad range.  One critique one might apply is that it was clearly high quality material, but not necessarily as distinctive as it could be.  With a bit more sweetness and floral range, or more distinctive bitterness, or other flavor range, feel, or whatever it might include, it would stand out more.  It's good though, reasonably balanced, clean, somewhat complex, and pleasant.  For this price it's probably better than it should be, and better value than you could find in the half dozen or so standard Western outlets.

It led me to looking at whatever else they sell, and a lot of the rest of their range is even more value oriented.  They tend to sell what looks like blended material pressings identified by year, by the Chinese zodiac sign that year.  To me this looks a lot like the Yunnan Sourcing standard themes.  Here's an example:

Year of Snake Raw Puerh, 357 grams, $14.82

Year of Roaster Raw Puer, 357 grams, $19.998, from 2016  (rooster; I kept the typo)

Those two cakes could change how someone is exploring sheng, or could just be extra daily drinkers to check out for someone years into the type preference.  Or they could be bad?  Low cost, low-medium quality sheng can still be positive, just not in the same ways that spending over $100 on a cake tends to work out.  You often give up aging potential.  But then you really need to try a tea aged to be completely sure how that's going to go, even after you are familiar with typical aging transition patterns.

That last one is a 2016 cake stored in Malaysia; it's hard to summarize what that might mean, if someone doesn't already know.  It's known for being a place to age tea quickly, the opposite of dry and cool Kunming storage.  9 years in Malaysia could represent a similar fermentation level to 15 in Kunming.  For a $20 standard sized cake!  That's unheard of in Western outlets, maybe beyond gambling on very mixed results through a vendor like King Tea Mall, a reseller who passes on whatever happens to turn up.

They do sell what is presented as more standard, higher quality, desirable origin specific teas.  Here is an example:

2009 NanNuo Ancient Tree Tea, $86.58 for a 357 gram cake

I've had fantastic experiences with the few Nan Nuo versions I've tried, and no average or below average results.  Here's their write-up for that tea:

NanNuo Ancient Tree Tea is a slightly domineering tea. The tea liquor entrance has a significant bitterness, which quickly dissipates and turns sweet, bitter with sweetness (just like Musang King). Since ancient times, NanNuo Mountain was a very famous ancient tea mountain. Meanwhile, there is also a key source of raw material for high-quality puer tea. There are abundant resources of ancient trees, which has made today's NanNuo Mountain a quality assurance reputation.

It's probably not that bitter at this point, 16 years later, stored in Malaysia (presumably).  But you don't have to trust their judgment, or sourcing aptitude, since they sell samples of lots of their sheng range (I didn't check if it covers this one; it doesn't, so for those more distinctive and costly cakes you would have to trust them).

For people open to gambling on an $87 cake that's an interesting option, 16 years old and from a desirable origin area.  Ordering other versions first could work, and what samples are available, to get a sense of their range.  

All of this isn't really intended as a sales pitch.  It's completely familiar background for people well into sheng exploration, or maybe not clearly thought through for people just getting started, or not yet started.  It's how you tend to evaluate new sources, and to decide what else to buy.  If a cake is in the $20 range sampling makes a lot less sense; you just try that kind of thing, and see how it goes.  Maybe not by buying a vendor's whole selection range, in case it doesn't work out; you'd mix buying a few types.  Having tea around that you don't like can be awkward.

But then if you aren't familiar with aging transition patterns that shifts things.  Some tea character / aspect starting points have plenty of potential, and some don't.  There's nothing like trying the same tea a couple times a year for 6 or 8 years to see how it is changing.  It can be awkward doing that if it seems great after 8 or 9 years, and then you run out of it, and can't buy more.  I sometimes buy a second cake of what seems most promising, then at least I'll have some after the exploration phase, even though a single cake isn't that much.

I'm not sure how this cake would age, what it would be like in 10 or 15 years.  Even more intensity might be a good sign, to build in potential for change.  They sell versions from this line going back to 2010, but those are from different identified origin areas, so not at all identical teas.  Versions from 2010 and 2011 are from Nan Nuo and Bulang, and sell for $81 and $78, which really could be a life-changing sourcing option if those are very good material teas.  

Now I wish that I could spend a few hundred dollars exploring those.  But I live in Honolulu part time on a Bangkok salary budget, and spend more on airfare than makes any sense at all, so I'll make due with what I can afford to try.  It could be interesting seeing what their lower end range is like.  One last tangent note:  they mention "dry storage" in one product description, for that 2011 tea:

The raw material selected by XiaoBaWang in 2009 is from BuLang Mountain, which is one of the six ancient tea mountains in China... Tea liquor tastes high sweetness, after 9 years of storage in the pure dry warehouse, it becomes thick and smooth, not astringent, not dry, and docile.

Dry for Malaysia is probably hot and humid for Kunming; it could all be relative.

Return to Hawaii; hiking to Mt. Olympus in Oahu

 

I've not been putting any focus on tea lately, returning to live with my kids in Honolulu a week or so ago.  It's been a busy week, and a busy month before that getting ready back in Bangkok.  I don't have so many deep, insightful thoughts to share so I'll add a bit on random impressions and then focus more on an interesting hike we just did.  I didn't even leave myself much interesting for a tea stash from last year; an old Xiaguan cake will be nice to drink, and the rest was mostly samples.

It was nice spending time at the Incheon, Korean airport during a layover on the way.  We often transit through Haneda in Japan, flying JAL, but this time I took Asiana, so transited in Korea.  Both are kind of equivalent; both are spacious, with decent services, and so much extra seating that it's not a problem to find a quiet gate area and lay down on an open row of seats for a nap.  They both have a decent amount of power cord stations, so that's not an issue.  Food options are fine at both, but I tend to eat snacks more than meals in between airline food meals.

One problem came up:  Korea doesn't have the same degree of tea culture, so there were no hot water dispensers for tea in that airport.  Of course coffee shops might give you some, or sell it to you, and there are lounges, mostly for business or first class customers, but it's not the same as in Japanese airports, or all over the place in China.  I cold-brewed a tea bag I'd brought of pu'er cake scraps, the extra bits that throw off brewing if you include that with separated more whole leaves.  It kind of worked.  As a parent it was tempting to walk into a baby care room to use hot water in one, since I'd spent so many years with free access to those places, which provide filtered hot water, but it just didn't seem right.

Related to the relocation reverse culture shock is always an interesting theme and experience.  I've lived in Honolulu three times over the last 2 1/2 years or so, generally for this same time period, for about 2 1/2 months.  I went to grad school in Honolulu so I'd lived here quite awhile ago for 2 years.

It's not so much that appearances, expectations, and experiences are so different that I need to adjust to them, it's just about things seeming different.  Then jet lag adds to that.  People look different, of course, but most people are Asian, which of course matches Bangkok.  Clothing styles are different, there are homeless people here (and not so much there), and the beach resort theme is different.  I love Hawaii, but I feel a little more at home in Bangkok, even though in general I hate large cities.  I lived in a ski resort area for a long time in Colorado, so that's familiar, being where others vacation, but it can also seem a little odd, when it's all your daily life instead.

I haven't ran yet; I've been quite busy, and jet lag made the first days rough [although I did twice, in between first writing this and editing, since I'm slow to post this].  The kids had spring break for the first half a week, so I spent every minute with them, the only way that would go.  I'd missed them terribly, even more than I miss the cats at home now.  Running is much nicer here; the air is clean, and much cooler, and it's breezy, with everywhere you go looking a bit like a postcard.

That hike

the top, from near the top

Of course it started with a late start; how else would it start ? I woke up really early (back to the jet lag theme) and walked up Kapiolani road to get malasadas at Leonard's bakery, at 6:30, and then by the time everyone else woke, ate, and made plans we didn't catch a bus until 10:30.  Kalani visited a friend instead, so only Keo and I hiked.  We had planned to do an easy route, up the St. Louis heights ridgeline to transition to Manoa valley, walking over the one side.  But then we talked and cruised on the walk up to that turn-off, and met an older guy there (79), who recommended that it would be a good day to go up to Mt. Olympus, because it's dry out now, so it wouldn't be muddy.  We really didn't bring even close to enough water to do that route, 1.5 liters between us, but we went up anyway.

We kept up a good pace over the next moderate section, not really pushing it, but eventually it got steep, and it was harder to keep effort level moderate to avoid sweating.  It took about an hour and a half from that trail branch, a bit difficult near the top, with ropes to hold while climbing steep sections, but we made it up.  The views were amazing.  We could see the next island over (Molokai, probably), and the other side of Oahu, Kaneohe on the east.  The pictures will tell that story.

Then we cruised down, trying to keep a good pace and moderate effort level.  That got harder as we dropped into the Manoa valley, with all that distance getting to us.  We were parched as we caught a bus, off to a McDonald's for a value meal, and cup after cup of Hi-C orange drink, after the first round of water.  It was really something.  

It was odd fitting the image of a homeless person so well on that McDonald's visit.  I was covered in dirt from using ropes to stabilize myself on really steep terrain, climbing up natural steps embedded in mostly dried mud.  I smelled terrible from sweating, and was a bit out of it.  There is no clear point to this part, no extra insight about taking up that social image; it was just odd.

Of course it involves adjustment getting back to this life, all the family dynamics, and extra demands.  Eye has been working a lot so I fill in most of the gaps, making meals, doing laundry, and making sure that kids' activities include outdoor time.  Keoni and I have swam out to a flag in a swim lane twice, 200+ meters / yards out in the ocean.  We met an old high school acquaintance once, on the beach to see fireworks (which were out of view; we were in the wrong place).  It has been nice.  I miss family, cats, and life in Bangkok, but being with the kids is worth all of that.

this looked to be a bit higher

Honolulu, mostly Waikiki, from pretty far up, showing the steps of the trail

the Manoa valley and Waikiki below

the east side (Kaneohe) from near the top

Keo!  no Kalani on this outing, which helped with the questionable call to summit that day

where I always take Kalani's photo

the trail beginning

Does tea attract a certain type of people?

 

A Reddit post just brought up this theme (here, Does tea attract a certain type of people?).  It's a great question.  Their speculation included adding this, cited in its entirety because this framing is really helpful:

I drink a lot in tea rooms and like to just sit and listen to people talk. Mostly there's a certain type around me though. Students, hippie people, artists, long-haired men, older liberal arts professors etc. I've never had anything like that happen in a coffee shop. Do you also feel like tea is attracted to a certain culture, that maybe goes against consumerism as opposed to people who drink coffee?

I commented this, and I'll add a little more here:

It is appealing to a range of different people, but it might not be a broad range. I've been writing a blog about tea for 11 years, and active in tea groups for longer, meeting people locally who are into tea, and this theme keeps coming up.

That list works for a start; hippies and tea kind of pair naturally. For some reason 30 or so year old guys working in IT can connect with tea, in plenty of cases. My guess is that it's easy to burn out on overdoing it with coffee, and there's a lot of novel experience to be had with tea, and a lot to learn. The "figuring it out" aspect can be appealing, to some.

People with somewhat liberal inclinations, who aren't necessarily hippies, can also naturally connect with tea. It helps being into nature themes, Eastern or foreign cultures, and to some extent aesthetics, since those are subjects that can overlap.

More conservative but open minded, typically older individuals can also get the appeal. For this approach point the exclusivity might connect, more than foreign cultural association. It's possible to learn, know things, and experience things that aren't really easily accessible to others; taken in one way tea can connect with status. Ownership of a collection of valuable clay tea pots might be part of the appeal, approached this way. Any of these people could wear an Asian oriented robe while drinking tea, or martial arts type clothing, but for most this wouldn't apply.

Some common characteristics are implied there:  openness to atypical experience, tendency for exploration, cultural openness, and individual connection with one or more parts of the tea experience (flavor / food oriented, tied to Asian culture, problem solving related to learning about types or brewing approach, appeal related to exclusivity, or ownership of hard to access range of goods or teas).  On the aesthetic side someone might want to wear Asian oriented clothing, or in a more common form they might just like drinking tea outside in nature.  

Drinking tea can be a meditative experience; coffee is perfect for picking up a to-go drink that travels well, and for one range of tea experience spending a half an hour or an hour appreciating multiple infusions of an exceptional version is a main point.  It's easy to see how aesthetics and other factors could adjoin that.

(also included in that post as a comment):  

At tea tasting last month in Bangkok, with people from all over the world. they didn't share one theme in common (besides liking tea), but openness to new experiences and cultural expression seemed common. No one really represented the "hippie" type, but two people covered some limited aspects of that general range (no, not the woman wearing a scarf).

One interesting tangent of all this is how it's natural for people who are into tea to expect some degree of shared experience, and perspective.  It seems like all "tea enthusiasts" go through making this assumption, then probably adjust it later on when they realize that it really does apply, in part, but then to some extent it also doesn't.

I never fully addressed the initial point that people into tea might oppose consumerism, which the OP linked to coffee interest, the person who initiated that group discussion.  Indirectly I rejected it, saying that one sub-segment of people into tea actually lean into purchasing exotic, costly tea types and teaware, using purchasing and ownership as a status symbol.  But at the same time that initial opposition to consumer culture kind of works, for many others.  People into tea tend to want to own a limited, basic set of gear for brewing a couple of different ways, and then it's less common for that to translate into a cycle of continual collection.  That does come up, but not for most.  Pu'er enthusiasts tend to collect the actual tea, since that type changes and can improve with age.  

Let's consider a limited example, from someone in that earlier picture who is one of my absolute favorite "tea friends."  I'm talking about Huyen, in Vietnam; this post works as well as any for an introduction to who she is, even though it's a bit dated now, and there's more to tell.

So what are we looking at here?  Obviously they collect teaware, and are into the aesthetic side.  But to me this doesn't represent a status-oriented pursuit of self-definition, a way to place themselves above others who also like tea, by owning things.  They are unusually into the aesthetic side of tea experience.  This didn't stem from a somewhat recent urge to collect that tea gear, versus focus on the experience; their family connection to tea goes way back.  

They don't share that much in common with American liberals though, related to the generality framed in the original post question.  That US left / right liberal / conservative divide wouldn't even be familiar to them, in the same sense it is to Americans.

Next one might wonder how much difference it makes preparing tea in this sort of teaware, versus using a very basic set-up.  Use of clay pots is functional, and it does change things, so that part isn't mostly aesthetic, even if partly so.

The aesthetic part of the experience adds a layer of function, I would expect.  When I mentioned that many people love combining tea experience with an outdoor setting I meant that it changes what you experience, the tone of it, how it feels.  If I drink tea outside, and I often do, on a cool and pleasant day it's quite different than having it at the dining room table.  Birds, a breeze, plants, natural sunlight; all of these add a slightly different dimension.  The same must be occurring in that comfortable and aesthetically pleasing tea room, in that photo.

This might come across as a little odd, but Huyen's family isn't smiling for that photo, they are expressing how they feel at that moment, and typically seem a lot more relaxed and joyful than just about anyone I've ever met with online.  And of course I meet Huyen in person from time to time; she's in the other picture before that, and in others I'm sharing here.  I don't think all that tea gear brings them this joy, but their lives seem to integrate in a positive way.  They seem radiant.  My take is that it stems from living in sync with their own core principles, and appreciating the connections they have with others, and with varying life experiences.  Surely tea is a part of that.  

Let's go a little further, with another photo example:

Huyen again!  And Seth, another good friend, at the bottom.  This was a meetup at our house, appreciating interesting teas in an outdoor setting (using really basic teaware).

This reminds me of a part of the initial intro to this topic, not addressed specifically there, about discussion forms or range that might go with drinking tea (where that intro was instead about the people doing the talking).  We sometimes discuss a lot about the actual teas, and I've written about these meetups in this blog, and cover some of that, but more often it's just personal discussion, about background, perspective, life events, and so on.  Politics comes up, but discussion tends to steer back off that relatively quickly, as a relevant subject that's not any more interesting than others.  

I guess that it's not so different than when anyone meets for any reason, to talk about anything.  But the shared perspective and experience theme somehow stands out, that travel themes come up, and cultural issues, philosophy and religion, and so on.  I'm sort of implying that everyone has more broad interests and experiences than average, but that's not really what I mean.  It's that these layers of experience seem to come to light, and to be seen as novel and interesting, where something like more mundane travel experience could just be about sharing having had experiences, without peeling back the layers of what those tended to mean.  

Why is an old Laos night market experience novel and appealing, maybe different than a modern Bangkok version of the same thing?  Hard to say, but one could speculate, and share perspective on that.  It's something about feel, and historical context experienced in the present, about a unique setting, and a local culture.

that's Korea; it's completely different

I have a photo with baby Keoni in it just like this (a Luang Prabang market; photo credit)

There's an inclination many travel-oriented tea enthusiasts share to seek out the original, earlier, more authentic tea experience.  It brings people to tea production areas, and old sections of remote Chinatowns, to old shops and tea houses.  

There is novel perspective and deep history out there.  But eventually all of that seems to connect people back to their own present-day life experiences, later on, after they process all of that.  They see that it's all about appreciating the moment, and connections with others, or to a place, or natural environment.  It's about the present continuing and extending the experiences people valued in the past.  It's this journey that can be particularly interesting, to share with others, and to hear of their version of it.

some people are living embodiments of older tea traditions; I see Cindy in this way

This reminds me of some of my own starting points; I'll share a couple here.  One early intro came from a work trip, a visit to Shenzhen, China, seeing a Gong Fu tea presentation at an IT product demonstration area there:

That may not have been the most authentic presentation of that cultural background, perhaps packaged and adjusted just a little, used as background for that other main sales scope theme, but most of what they shared was completely genuine and valid.

the Wonosari tea plantation, on Java, Indonesia. 

I don't travel specifically related to tea, doing family trips instead, but I have seen it growing a few times.  That kind of experience and connection could be especially meaningful to tea enthusiasts.  In that area shown in the photo, in Java, Indonesia, it ties back to the older Dutch history, and on to what modern people experience, and how their tea culture is currently changing.  As tea culture is transitioning everywhere, and many aspects of many local cultures are.  Tea related experience can make for an interesting lens to view those layers of changes through.

Let's take this in a more controversial direction before closing; there can be a darker side to cultural transitions.  All sorts of people would love all sorts of travel experiences, and older cultures and history can end up being packaged for consumption in all sorts of ways (as tea history was in an IT equipment vending demonstration center).

This represents Polynesian cultures being interpreted and presented for appreciation in a popular Oahu, Hawaii based theme park.  Looked at one way there is nothing controversial or questionable about this; these parts of those local traditions are very well-grounded in earlier and relatively recent history.  But this could seem like a caricature of those forms and images, to others, as an example of appropriation.

It's definitely presented for-profit, which isn't necessarily problematic, but that opens the door to a possible tendency to package what works well, maybe even adjusting that content a little, and skip over parts that aren't so relatable.  Did colonization destroy some of that earlier cultural experience and expression?  Surely it did.  This park is owned and ran by Mormons; I suppose that framing doesn't help.  They recruit younger Polynesian adults to work in the park, which sort of helps, but in one sense that's better and in another potentially worse.

I'm not saying that tea history is being obliterated while being re-packaged for Western consumption, but history and culture is always being overwritten, to a certain extent.  Hopefully tea exploration, and especially tea tourism, takes on forms that continue to value what really occurred in the past, and honors and preserves the modern living cultures.  This is the kind of thing I tend to find people at tea meetups most interested in discussing; how what came before translates into interesting experiences and perspectives that are available now.

Farmerleaf Na Lang Laos sheng pu'er

This is the sheng pu'er version I talked about, I think, that I tried with William and cited in the last post about meeting him, a Spring 2024 Na Lang from Laos.

Since I've already introduced this tea I'm going to strip down these tasting notes to what it seemed like to me, removing a lot of the speculation or tangents.  I'll add a little back in with the conclusions, but this will work well kept shorter, without the usual rambling on.  This is William's site description (part of it):

Spring 2024, medium-big trees from forested gardens (listing for $140 per 357 gram cake)

Na Lang village, Nyot Ou District, Laos

A powerful Yiwu-style tea with great endurance 

This is typically the kind of tea you would find in Gua Feng Zhai for twice the price. The point of this tea is not the fragrance, but the good thickness in the soup and the deep Huigan. 

Considering the renown of Yiwu tea, and the high prices its tea fetch, it is not surprising that many tea traders cross the border to Laos and source tea from Nyot Ou district. As a result, most of the tea made in Nyot Ou is bought by tea producers from Yiwu.

Tea grows in the forests of Nyot Ou district along two valleys. The Southern valley is connected to Gua Feng Zhai village through a small road. The environment in which tea grows is similar in Eastern Yiwu and in the two tea producing valleys of Nyot Ou District. Ancient tea trees grow along more recently established gardens in the forests.

from the Farmerleaf site product page

That's a common, well-known theme, that lots of tea from lots of places goes back to China to become pu'er.  I skipped the "pu'er-like tea" limitation earlier, the admission that the type is a regionally limited designation, only applying to teas from Yunnan.  That's a bit absurd, isn't it, given that context, that any tea from Laos, Vietnam, or Myanmar (and less from Thailand) that crosses the border, and is mis-represented in terms of origin, sort of is and also isn't pu'er?  And a very considerable volume of tea undergoes this transition, far more than is ever sold as Laos tea.

It's the best of both worlds for Chinese producers and vendors; they can dismiss those origin area teas as separate and inferior, and then buy them and resell those same teas as the upgraded local version, simply by blending and then mis-labeling them.  Let's move on to how this tea is.

I never do address whether this is like Yiwu or not, a claim made in this description.  I've experienced relatively consistent character in trying a reasonable amount of Yiwu, but it's my impression that I've not experienced a lot more than I've tried, especially related to distinctive versions and higher quality levels.  So I'll just describe what I am experiencing.

I think it makes sense for vendors to never mention much about flavor range.  It would vary over time, and even more so in relation to varying interpretations.  In this review I mention it seeming to taste different when trying this same tea two different times, and I speculate about why that is, real factors that could've changed what I experienced, not just the interpretation.  

William's description doesn't even include a general flavor reference, like "floral," and again I see that as reasonable.  To some it would seem floral, and to others fruity, and different factors could change the compound inputs that these are based on.  It's fine as long as a description can pass on enough range description to draw interest, or inform in some other way.

Review:

First infusion:  a little light, but that's a good way to start, brewing the first round fast to get an initial sense, and letting the second be more typical of the rest.  Flavor is good; quite catchy.  There's a pine-like aspect that others could interpret related to other vegetal range, but only a little.  A fruity tone is something else, on towards juicyfruit gum, or back in the range of natural flavors not really tied to just one, but not so far off tangerine.  Feel is nice; it has some structure, already, but that doesn't seem to track towards being unapproachable.

I've already tried this tea, so this isn't the blind tasting approach I typically use.  I know where this is going, and this tea version is pretty exceptional.  I'll fill in more of an aspects list next round.  

It's completely whole leaf material, not too compressed, so it would be easy to drink it unbroken, but I used some from the parts that had already split off in this tasting, more broken material.  Maybe that's not ideal, but I suppose it's a normal real-life experience form.  I hadn't thought it through getting it ready; depending on how focused in I am I might use the broken material also in the wrapper or carefully separate off some relatively whole leaves.

Second infusion:  that catchy fruit related tone really pops in a stronger round.  Bitterness and astringency really ramp up too; those would be more moderate if someone was more careful about not breaking the leaves.  

The bit of pine, or however that vegetal edge is interpreted, integrates wonderfully with the sweetness, bitterness, fruit tone, and background floral range.  

Intensity is good; I supposed based on what I said in the post about talking with William I should comment on that.  It's not by way of harsh aspects being dominant either; in better quality cakes strong sweetness, bitterness, feel, and positive flavors really stand out.  This is really clean in overall effect; it's not as if young sheng tends to be murky, or to taste like a cinderblock, as comes up more with Liu Bao, but there can be an emergent sort of impression of clarity and cleanness, or lack of that.  

This doesn't seem completely identical to when I first tried it with William.  It was exceptional then, and it is now, but minor inputs can vary, shifting the outcome.  I'm using water from a hot water dispenser and filtration system, so it's not at full boiling point; that changes things.  It's a different version of water.  This leaf is little more broken, as I've mentioned.  We drank this tea in the middle of trying a half dozen versions; that can affect impression and memory.  It seemed to include more bright floral range in that tasting, leaning towards bright citrus, and it probably did, based on those differences. 

Third infusion:  the tone seems to be warming.  It had warmth and depth before, but it's evolving to include a lot of that.  The leaf color is mixed, including some darker range, making me wonder if somehow oxidation level didn't vary a little in this initially.  How?  I'll add more about one thing William said in the conclusions, that might have entered in.

I personally love that effect, when sweetness, flavor complexity, and slight warmth gives a young sheng a much more approachable character.  I suppose people could be mixed on how they relate to that input and effect.  

I'm not doing justice to what I take to be a fruit tone.  It's not so far off dried mango, which surely isn't all one thing, since there are lots of kinds of mangos.  That one flavor input is positive, but it's how it integrates with the rest that works well.  It's intense and refined enough, which can be hard to place within the entire sheng range, or in relation to higher quality versions, or typical Yiwu styles. 

I didn't mention that the intensity carries over to aftertaste experience.  That almost goes without saying, but not completely.

Fourth infusion:  now that warm, sweet aspect tastes more like dried apricot to me, so much so that I'm questioning my earlier interpretations.  It's a lot like apricot, a pretty direct match.  It's quite delicious.  There is plenty of astringency and bitterness to balance it, but it's a quite approachable tea, at the same time.  Someone being more careful than I was to not break the leaves would moderate those parts just a little.

Intensity is so good, and flavors so fresh and bright, that it seems this will go on forever.  It won't; based on trying an earlier cycle this will make a lot of infusions, using the high proportion that's my default, but eventually flavors will thin and bitterness will play a different role.  It's great while it lasts though, which is for awhile.  The bitterness and sweetness stays in your mouth after you drink it, along with that fruit flavor, adding some extra exposure to appreciate.

Fifth infusion:  it's not transitioning all that much, which is as well, because I'm running out of patience for making these notes anyway.  Feel might become richer; that's an interesting shift, for this stage.  It has had pretty good feel structure for this whole cycle, but it gains just a little richness, towards a pleasant sappy feel.  To me that one interesting and positive fruit note integrating with the rest well is the main story, with other range playing a supporting role.  

Conclusions:

It's good, very intense, refined, pleasant, interesting, well-balanced, and so on.  I can't place it in relation to Yiwu range, but this probably is the best Laos sheng I've ever tried, and it might be about the 15th version I've tried.  The warm fruit range was interesting.  Floral tones are often dominant, across a lot of sheng range.  Versions can transition quite a bit, aging over even 9 months or so, but this was quite warm and fruity, and a year of aging input wouldn't cause that.

Back to that oxidation input issue:  William had said that if a producer backs off the kill-green completeness even a little (if I'm remembering this part right) that the stems can not be as fully fixed (compounds inactivated).  Then these can turn redder, more oxidized, as the tea dries, shifting the final character.  Maybe that happened in this?  It would explain the darker colors in some of the material, and also those heavier tones, the fruit range versus the floral, and warmth.

That's all just speculation.  The tea is really nice, the main thing.

Is it worth $140 a cake?  Sure, if someone is open to paying that for it.  It's novel, so there isn't any one established market supply and demand based pricing level.  It could be $500 or 1000, if people are open to paying that.  

There's a general expectation that quality level and range of related experiences out there are the competing factors; there are ways to buy a lot of Yiwu versions, and some other Laos teas, just none that I've tried like this.  If somewhat equivalent versions really do tend to cost $280 instead then maybe this is a great value.  I'm not buying any teas that cost over $100 per cake, so I'm just not part of the whole community, in one sense.  That's about budget limitation, not idealism.  If my tea budget was much different I'd buy this, for sure, but I certainly don't experience that as a regret.  My life balance is something to be thankful for, not to focus on regrets over.

Beyond those concerns the tea character is really interesting and positive.  I've really appreciated the opportunity to try this, and to have some to drink, since William shared a fair amount, not just a sample.  Many thanks to him!