Tea Tracks Mengsong Xiang (2019) and Ya Nua Gushu (2018)

 

Back to reviewing!  I quit while I visited family in the East Coast of the US, in Pennsylvania, and now I'm back in Bangkok.

I don't want to say too much about these, two sheng pu'er versions from Tea Tracks, sent by a friend to try.  I'm not that familiar with the narrow local areas, although Meng Song kind of rings a bell, and I don't know much about them for backstory.  The website mentions these details:

Meng Song Xiang 2019 - 勐宋  (114 Euro / $124 per 200 gram cake)

Meng Song Xiang is a village in southern Menghai. This tea is made of ancient tree material (gu shu, 古树). It has a full body and a pleasant bitterness, which lingers in the mouth as a fruity sweetness for a long time. Here is a review of the tea (in German): puerh.blog Meng Song review

Taste:  Soft yet bold taste. Upfront bitterness that turns into a sweet sensation.

Trees:  Old trees (gu shu 古树) growing in a natural environment

Origin:  Meng Song, Menghai, Yunnan, China

Ya Nuo 亚诺 2018 (You Le Shan)  (120 Euro / $130 per 200 gram cake)

Ya Nuo is a village on You Le Shan (mountain), one of the old six famous tea mountains in Xishuangbanna. This tea is made of ancient tree material (gu shu, 古树). The tea starts out very softly in the first brews with hardly any bitterness, but develops a nice sensation in the aftertaste. 

This is one of the teas that can clear your head on a cloudy day.

Taste:  Soft and subtle taste that develops a cooling sweet aftertaste.

Trees:  Old trees (gu shu 古树) growing in a natural environment

Origin:  Ya Nuo (village), You Le Shan, Xishuangbanna, Yunnan, China

Harvest:  early Spring 2018

The teas seemed pretty solid when trying them, but it's hard for me to evaluate value in relation to pricing beyond a limited range.  I could tell they seemed pretty good but not really how good.  I suppose then it's on considering how much I like them, setting that aside.  I don't buy pu'er that costs over 50 cents a gram, so of course I would run out of benchmark range. 

These are almost sold out on the website; there won't be much marketing function in describing these, since they'll be gone any day now.  The reviews might be partly about that but also just to communicate about trying teas, and to see what I make of them in notes.

Review:

Mengsong:  pleasant; definitely some bitterness stands out.  This flavor profile is somewhat familiar but I'm not going to do justice to describing it.  Beyond bitterness there is some sweetness, and from there identifying even aspect ranges is difficult.  Floral?  There is definitely a pleasant mineral layer, a little on the dry side, but pleasant in flavor and feel (to the extent that the two ranges map together).  There's good structure to the feel.

So far this just sounds like describing sheng pu'er in general.  It is pretty standard sheng, in one sense, just a better than average version, and only type-typical related to a subset, to Mengsong area versions.  5 years of aging has softened this, probably, although there is still plenty of bitterness and feel structure.  The tones have surely warmed some.  Maybe I'll readjust to reviewing more as rounds go by.

Ya Nua:  to me this expresses a distinctive root spice aspect.  Think along the lines of sassafras, but it's probably not so close to that.  It's not so far off the standard incense spice range, and if I had better scent memory of the main few incense spice versions I could reference one it's closest to.  That has the character overlapping just a little with aromatic wood tones.  Bitterness and mineral are dialed back just a little in comparison with the other, but it's still reasonably intense.  It might slightly less complex.  Better luck with deriving two flavor lists next round.

Mengsong 2:  I brewed these on the fast side for using a relatively high proportion, and for both being on the intense side.  It was still a bit much; I can switch to 5 second rounds to adjust further.  It's not that I forgot that I usually tend to overdo it with proportion, I just didn't offset it.

There's a catchy, familiar range in this I wish that I could describe better.  It's a way in which feel structure, bitterness, floral tone, and mineral all combine, in a very integrated form.  It comes across as a familiar set of aspects, that naturally pair together.  Maybe this is what people would seek out in standard Mengsong experience, a good version of it, but of course I can't claim that.  I don't retain a matrix of memorized local area types, and I might never, regardless of how long I kept trying different things.  

Would people seek out a 5 year old version, and how is the storage input for this if they were inclined to?  Those are harder to answer.  This aspect set is dialed in though; the proportion of everything is as it should be, and there are no flaws, no out of place aspects.  You're signed on for bitterness in drinking it, but to me that's moderate, even if it's higher than I would've expected for a partly age-transitioned tea.  Maybe this wasn't stored in a very humid place.  To me that's fine, aging and changing a tea over more slowly, unless there is a reason to get it moving quickly, for example to get a factory tea that will need 20-25 years to be good to cover that ground in 15.  I suppose at a minimum saying more about the floral range in this would be helpful, but not much comes to mind for labeling it.

Ya Nua:  this picked up a little depth and smoothed out some in character; it's better.  It's slightly more subtle now, but it still has a lot going on.  Bitterness hasn't faded but it's moderate compared to the other.  There is plenty of mineral range and other deeper flavor complexity, it's just not as forward and dominant as in the other version.  Spice tones still make up a main part of the experience.  Feel has decent structure, even a touch of dryness, all of which prevents it from coming across as thin.  At 6 years old (probably 6 1/2) this will head into that range where it shifts over from being new to old right around now, and maybe flavors seeming a little less forward now is a part of that.

As with the other it comes across as quite clean and well balanced to me, lacking flaws or limitations.  I suppose flavor complexity either settling out, for now, or being limited earlier on could be a limitation, but I see that as more character neutral, just how it is.  Something being out of balance would be more what I'm referring to, or a negative aspect.

At two rounds in I'm already feeling this.  I'm finally back in Bangkok, which is why I'm reviewing again, back in this familiar hot and humid environment, and even though it's 9 AM it's warmer than Pennsylvania had been during a cooler mid-afternoon.  It's too bad that more people back there don't appreciate the great tea drinking weather.

Mengsong 3:  this is shifting, in a pleasant way.  A bit more spice tone picks up, not completely unlike the range found in the other, just not the same either.  

Ya Nua:  less transition, but the tones may be warming slightly.  This seems like a good round to let it transition and get back to describing it more next time.

Mengsong 4:  it's interesting how bright and fresh this is, for being a 5 year old tea.  I could try to guess about how this has softened in character over that time, how it would've been more intense and challenging within the first year or two.  In part that would relate to describing what could be taken as positive about somewhat drier range storage.  Or maybe just a medium humidity and heat input range version; it's easy to pick up a biased judgment of norm here in Bangkok, where both are dialed up to maximum.

It's also interesting to consider where this will go from here, what relatively full aging might look like for it, when, and in what character range.  It needs at least another decade, or maybe more for full transition.  It's in a decent place for drinking as somewhat transitioned tea now, I suppose not so far out of entering into the teen years phase, when it might not make as much sense.  I certainly can't project ahead and list out likely flavor range to develop, but the intensity and balance at this stage seem like a good sign, that it's holding up well so far.

Ya Nua:  this is less complex and intense, but it has an interesting character, and plenty of intensity related to providing a pleasant experience now.  It's not muted.  The earlier spice range is still dominant, and a bit of vegetal range might've picked up as well, along the lines of tree leaf, not exactly like wood, but kind of related.  Maybe it only shifted in form, and it had seemed more like aromatic wood earlier, now vegetal in a different sense.  In most forms that would seem like a flaw, a subject I've already referenced, but with plenty of spice tones and mineral range it integrates well in this.

For someone preferring intensity of experience the other might be better.  One might question if this doesn't express a different kind of depth, related to the gushu theme, a standard idea that forward flavors might not be as intense but a base of depth could stand out more.  I don't know.  Both are fairly balanced; both have plenty going on across a significant range.  Underlying mineral range is a strength for both.

A different kind of acid test comes to mind, based on having visited "home" recently, drinking mostly a half dozen versions of tea for a month:  which would I keep returning to, if I had plenty of both?  I really love approachable, interesting, sweeter range, even fruity sheng, more than these two styles.  Sometimes I do crave a more intense experience, and it's not hard to appreciate good quality in tea versions.  Probably I like the Mengsong more.  It's more standard and less novel, in a sense, and would fill more of a craving for intensity and complexity, when that comes up.  I tend to go in cycles, and I'll even drink harsher teas sometimes, a bit here and there for weeks, like not quite ready Xiaguan tuos (which seem to never be fully ready, maybe until 25 or 30 years along, even aged in Bangkok).

Mengsong 5:  better than ever; the character really integrates.  In terms of description it's still about the same, but the balance has shifted to work even better.

Ya Nua:  this is still interesting for being on the subtle side, as sheng goes, related to flavor, which is perhaps a bit odd since it's on the intense side as oolong or black teas go, never mind white tea.  Then it has a lot of depth, including some bitterness, and great mineral range, so the intensity is there, just not in terms of forward flavors, as in the other.

It's breezy out just now; that's not usually the case in Bangkok.  At 9:30 it's sort of cool (30 C / 86 F and 71 % RH), or at least what I'll need to adapt to as cool for here.  At its maximum the PA "Indian summer" was in the mid-80s, but much, much drier.  Running there was fantastic.  It was easy to pick a time to go out when it was only 60 or so (16 C), so "cold" that your body heat would never accumulate.

Mengsong 6:  I'm maxed out for tea, and these aren't changing that much anyway, so this will do for notes.  Again it's interesting and pleasant how the earlier floral tones have transitioned more into a spice range.  The brightness, intensity, and complexity are all quite positive in this.  This seems like the kind of tea everyone should own a cake of, I just don't.  This version should cost a bit, for as good as this seems.  I suppose it's possible that the most recent peak in sheng pu'er costs happened just after this was made, so it might be more reasonable than I expect [not really, unless more current pricing is really high].

Ya Nua:  quite nice; good depth, good balance, interesting character.  I love the other one more, so that offsets that positive judgment some.  I think that has to do with relation to preference as much or more as quality, or it being more interesting.  I suppose local area demand shifts pricing as much as any of those other factors, so cost could relate to what other people seem to value, or at least what the market takes up and promotes.

Conclusions:

Both pretty good teas.  I kept going back and forth over how good while trying them.  They seem better in quality than they are a close match to my own natural preferences; I like them, but they're probably better than a match to my preference indicates.

Since other people sometimes value more aged character ranges that I don't love it can be hard to project ahead to what others might like later on, as they transition more.  Often I'd fill in more guesses about that, but it wouldn't be based on much, and would be unreliable, so I may as well skip that part.

I had a fairly typical experience with trying a tea in this general age range just today, the day after making these notes, so I'll mention that.  I re-tried a Nan Nuo version that I really liked, that I had drank most of the cake of back when it was new, made in a really bright, fresh, sweet, approachable when young style, from 2017.  It was still ok, but not nearly as positive as it had been 6 years ago.  It wasn't simply fading away as much as I'd expected, but it had been a good call to mostly drink straight through that over a year's time back then, setting a little aside to see how it might change later.

These are different, and especially the Mengsong seems to be retaining some intensity and complexity.  The Ya Nua version had interesting character too, it was just more subtle already.  It's interesting how sheng versions need to be made in a very specific style, related to aspects included, and I guess to how versions are processed, or else the flavor tones warm but they seem to oxidize instead of fermenting.  Or so it seems to me, but then what do I know.

back to my favorite tasting spot

cleaning up after a month of unmanaged growth in the garden

October must have been a bit rainy

Teaberry and partridgeberry tisanes (natural wintergreen herb tea)

 

teaberry!  aka wintergreen.

partridgeberry; smaller, rounder leaves.

I've long since been intrigued by the possibility of making an herb tea / tisane from teaberry leaves, or at least a plant type I grew up knowing as teaberry.  In reviewing background for this post it turns out that two different local plants--that are common where I'm from, Western Pennsylvania, where I visit now--are both probably referred to as teaberry, when one is a variation of partidgeberry.  Or so a couple of online sources indicate; it's hard to drill down to the absolute fact of the matter in online references.  

Let's start with what I understood, beyond picking and eating what I took to be teaberries.  I've read different accounts about using teaberry as a tisane, including a claim that it oxidizes well, as "real tea" does.  Here is more background, from the book "Secrets of Native American Herbal Remedies:"

Wintergreen (Gaultheria Procumbens) is an aromatic evergreen shrub native to North America.  Also called Canada tea and deerberry, wintergreen is often used to relieve pain and inflammation.  The leaves of wintergreen contain methyl salicylate, which is closely related to aspirin.  Several tribes, including the Delaware and Mohican, have used a tea made from the leaves to treat kidney disorders.  The Great Lakes and Eastern Woodland tribes have used poultices from wintergreen, applying them topically to treat arthritic aches and pains.

That hadn't really the basis for my interest, but it was interesting.  Wikipedia adds this, about teaberries:

The fruits of G. procumbens, considered its actual "teaberries", are edible, with a taste of mildly sweet wintergreen similar to the flavors of the Mentha varieties M. piperita (peppermint) and M. spicata (spearmint) even though G. procumbens is not a true mint. The leaves and branches make a fine herbal tea, through normal drying and infusion process. For the leaves to yield significant amounts of their essential oil, they need to be fermented for at least three days.

teaberry leaves with moderate bruising, not nearly enough to enable oxidation

teaberry leaves bruised and chopped

It was partly this oxidation potential that made it interesting.  This Youtube video clarifies the difference between partridgeberries and teaberries, confirming that both are edible, as fruits (berries) or leaves.  That correct identification helps explain why the partridgeberry fruit is a little bit minty but the leaves aren't overly so.  This Youtube video passes on guidance for finding and identifying "real" teaberry.

This plant source covers more background, about that second plant type:

Mitchella repens, Partridgeberry, Partridge Berry, Native Bare Root Perennial

A trailing, evergreen herb with white, fragrant, tubular flowers in pairs. Partridgeberry is a creeping, perennial herb, no taller than 2 in. high. All parts are dainty, including its pairs of small, rounded, evergreen leaves; tiny, trumpet-shaped, pinkish-white flowers; and scarlet berries.

A most attractive woodland creeper with highly ornamental foliage, it can be used as a groundcover under acid-loving shrubs and in terraria in the winter. The common name implies that the scarlet fruits are relished by partridges, and they are consumed by a variety of birds and mammals. Indian women drank a tea made from the leaves as an aid in childbirth.

No one brews an herb tea / tisane from either of these plants where I'm from, typically; the teaberry name isn't necessarily taken as an indication that drying and brewing the leaves would be a great idea.

I've tracked down both, growing right beside my parents' and brother's homes, and have made a tisane out of both (attempting some rolling of the leaves, then drying them).  At time of writing an early draft I've only brewed the teaberry leaves, but I will write this related to trying the other.

Teaberry tastes minty, as this one passage suggests; the leaf flavor really is "wintergreen."  The teaberries don't taste that much like the leaves, but there is some overlap.  I'll skip adding more on partidgeberry character in this intro section, but related to tasting fresh leaves they just taste a bit vegetal, without much flavor coming through at all.

Preparation and review:

I tried out bruising / rolling the leaves to support oxidation, but it didn't seem to have much effect.  I'm not sure that the compounds in these leaves are right for this transition (either of them, really), or if I just didn't bruise them enough.  I suspect using a mortar and pestle and really grinding the leaves a bit would help, where I just tried rolling the partridgeberry with a rolling pin, and pounding the teaberries with a mallet for tenderizing meat, then slicing those into thin strips, to support more air contact to internal leaf compounds.  Onto review notes then.

teaberry / wintergreen brewed on the lighter side

Teaberry:  it tastes like wintergreen.  For some people that's all I would need to say, if that mint flavor range is familiar.  It's less peppery than peppermint or spearmint, but closer to spearmint for being milder.  It's quite sweet and pleasant.  I didn't use enough to really dial up infusion strength, maybe 3 grams for two rounds of Western style brewing, but it was enough to see how it would work out.

It seems odd breaking that down further.  It was minty, along that particular line for flavor, wintergreen.  There's not much to add.  There was no astringency, or vegetal range character.  I suspect that variation and depth could be had by properly oxidizing the leaves, but I'm out of time to experiment with that here, and I'm not carrying fresh plant leaves back to Thailand.  I could rapidly dry some, skipping an oxidation step, but I've already tried that prepared herb version.

I brewed the leaves twice and mixed the mostly spent leaves with partly brewed out black tea, from breakfast, and the resulting mix tasted strongly of that one mint note, in a pleasant way.  Apparently they had more to give.  Simmering the leaves might be promising, really forcing flavor extraction.  Or there's a masala chai trick of simmering tea and herbs, letting it sit, re-simmering it, and letting it sit again, resulting in brewing at or near boiling point temperature for an extended time.

Partridgeberry:  there is a trace of mint, but not much, and beyond that the vegetal range flavor is a bit subtle.  It doesn't taste like much.  It's nice that it can be used as a tisane, and I suppose it could be helpful if it really does have medicinal qualities, but related to the experience of drinking it there just isn't that much going on.  Teaberry leaves as a tisane are interesting and pleasant, but partridgeberry leaf isn't.

One might wonder why I'm going on and on about plants that produce berries in relation to brewing the leaves, and leaving the berries out of it, not brewing those.  They're not berries in the sense of strawberries or raspberries; they're subtle in character.  Teaberries are pleasant, sweet and minty, but partridgeberries don't taste like much at all.  Teaberries aren't really flavorful enough to be promising as a tisane, brewed alone, although maybe I'm wrong, and that might work.

There's one mystery left in all this, related to ligonberries, which are described as the same thing as partridgeberries in some references.  How is this possible?  Ligonberries are relatively similar to cranberry; they should be quite flavorful and tart, but these are almost entirely flavorless.  Two possibilities come to mind, but there may be others:  these aren't really a variation of ligonberries (or just that, called a different name), or they are related but it's a plant type variation, that isn't identical.  I don't know, really.  Intensity could vary by season, related to time of the year, but surely not as much as this, to cause a strong-flavored berry to be flavorless some of the time.

At any rate the one plant people refer to as teaberries locally really is that, and its berries are sweeter and more flavorful, with the leaves "wintergreen" in flavor.  The other doesn't taste like much, as berries or dried and brewed leaves.

Family visit photos, back to Western Pennsylvania

As I'd mentioned I've been in Western PA, visiting my family.  These notes, and most of the text, is from that visit, and I finish the editing while traveling back to Bangkok again.  I won't add much more about that, but I will share some photos from there.

view from a balcony at my parents' house

the colors change fast; this was two weeks later

a hunting lodge sort of theme

again earlier in the stay, a creek beside their house

not much later, showing more color

my kids and two cousins

meeting those kids was a main highlight (and one other); it was hard leaving them

Bi Yu and Lishan Taiwanese rolled oolongs

 

I'm reviewing two very interesting and pleasant Taiwanese rolled oolongs, from Tea Mania, a vendor based in Switzerland.  Peter, the owner, passed on these samples in a visit awhile back (many thanks).  There's a lot to say about them so I'll cite the product listings for more background and get on with the review notes section.

I might first add that I was really more into rolled oolong scope very early in tea exploration; it's essentially where I started, checking out Thai versions that were around (in Bangkok).  Variety and quality scale is pretty broad, and it's my opinion that the best versions come from Taiwan.  I tried a pretty good more oxidized and roasted Tie Guan Yin, from Anxi, China, not too long ago, but these are something else.  Thailand can make ok versions, and Vietnamese range can be better than Thailand's, really extending to the top of the Taiwanese quality range in the rarest cases, but it could be hard to find those best of the best versions from there.

Bi Yu  (15 CHF or $17.63, seemingly for 50 grams)

Bi Yu is a rare Taiwanese cultivar that descends from the well-known Qing Xin and Jin Xuan cultivars. The aroma profile of Bi Yu lies between the two parents, Qing Xing and Jin Xuan. A decisive difference is the pronounced fruitiness which is underlined by floral notes.

Due to the traditional processing, it can be stored without any loss of aroma. With increasing age, the aroma changes and develops its very own charm.

Harvest date: spring 2021

Aroma: fruity, with light, floral notes on the finish

Oxidation: approx. 40%

Roasting: middle

Terroir: Mingjian, Nantou, Taiwan

Lishan Gaoshan Wulong (30 CHF or $35.25 for 50 grams)

Lishan Gaoshan Wulong is a slightly oxidized, bouquet style highland tea from Lishan. Due to the slight oxidation the tea has a very floral and refreshing character, which reminds of the floral in the green tea, but due to the processing as wulong tea it has a much stronger body and is a much more intensive taste experience. With the slightly oxidized wulong, the leaves are not shaken as much, but are handled much more gently. This means that there are no red leaf edges, which makes the tea taste much more floral and refreshing. The infusion in the cup is also much brighter. The reverberation in the mouth is still clearly perceptible even over a longer period of time and it is a pleasure to trace the character of the tea in meditative silence and to fathom its complex character more and more.

Lishan Gaoshan Wulong is not roasted and only slightly but nevertheless well oxidized. Thus the character of highland teas is clearly visible. Due to the traditional processing it can be stored without any problems and without losing its aroma. With increasing age, the aroma changes and develops its very own charm.

Harvest time: spring 2020

Aroma: floral, with notes of osmanthus and honey

Oxidation: approx. 20%

Roasting: non

Terroir: Lishan, Nantou, Taiwan

Note that these are from different years, 2021 for the Bi Yu, and 2020 for the Lishan, and oxidation level is higher for the Bi Yu, with only that version roasted.  I don't speculate about those inputs in these review notes (I checked the descriptions and added them later in editing), focusing on the experienced aspects instead.  Even that tends to run long.

I've researched and written quite a bit about Taiwanese cultivars in this blog, just nothing for the last half a dozen years.  I'll also skip going into any of that, but anyone interested could search it up here.  One reference I cite in those posts covers what the older plant types and newer hybrid cultivars are.  Jin Xuan is an example of the newer range (#12 in that series), as Bi Yu must be.  Qing Xin is really a range of more original plant types, not just all one thing genetically, according to this research study reference.

this post covers more about this, with the table from this reference

Bi Yu left, in all photos

Review:

Bi Yu:  it's quite good; I expected that.  There is an intensity of floral range and mineral base that's distinctive across most Taiwanese rolled oolongs, and this expresses that.  Floral range is intense and complex.  A mineral base is harder to notice but that is what helps ground the rest, making it come across as a very complex experience.  

Intensity is good, on the high side.  I brewed this for longer than a typical infusion to get it started from still completely dry and compacted, for 30 seconds or just over, and it's not on the light side at all.  The effect is just as it should be.  

Related to regional character, tied to the origin, or the cultivar type, I won't be able to comment on what is or isn't most type-typical; I just don't drink that much Taiwanese oolongs.  I've had good versions before, but it will still even be hard to place these within the scope of the highest quality range.  It's quite good; that's all I can tell.  I may not be able to get much further than describing this as expressing complex floral range; it's not one of my things to list out 3 or 4 flowers this resembles.

Lishan:  interesting!  I had expected this to be pretty similar to the other version, but it's not.  It's creamier, and it includes a nutty sort of flavor aspect.  Plenty of sweetness and floral range too, but it's quite different.  A touch of vegetal range enters in along with the floral tone, and the rest, but it's limited, and hard to place.  That might either develop or else drop out, and then I'd have either some or no chance of describing it further.  Mineral is a little different in this too.  It's so heavy that it leans a little towards salt or metal, in a good sense.  Maybe that vegetal range links with a savory edge too, and I'm just not connecting the parts appropriately.  

In re-trying the first version after tasting this the aftertaste in the Bi Yu version extends longer.  It's really pretty close to what I expected this tea to be like.  Am I thinking of conventional Alishan character instead?  I'm not at all clear on tea production areas in Taiwan, and tea plant types also factor in.

Bi Yu #2:  I brewed these for about 15 seconds, probably long enough to draw out plenty of intensity.  I didn't have the best guess for proportion in these, having been mostly off rolled oolongs for awhile, trying only a few over the last year, but I guessed it would be a good bit, a gaiwan full, so on towards the 10 grams I might often brew at one time.  It's too much for many people's preference, but kind of familiar range to me.  It will limit getting far through a full infusion cycle of two versions.

Creaminess picks up.  Intensity would also, if it hadn't been so intense in the first round, but I think the added complexity makes it come across as stronger.  Feel is nice and rich, aftertaste range is extended and pleasant.  The main story is intense floral taste.  It's almost like that new car smell, but in a good sense, a little towards plastic of an unusual kind.  But it's heavy floral range instead, a theme that's quite familiar to anyone who has explored much above average quality Taiwanese oolongs.  

Is this an example of one of the most pleasant styles, and highest quality levels?  Maybe, at least towards that.  I've heard someone criticize Taiwanese oolongs for being too intense before, claiming that they're accomplishing that through heavy fertilizer use.  I'm skeptical that's true, but it's at least possible.  Then that leads me back to considering food issues; would we be shocked to learn that a producer is using fertilizer to grow our tomatoes or spinach?  It would be surprising if they didn't.  I love the idea of wild-grown, natural conditions produced tea as much as the next person, but I'm not hung up on it.

[later editing note]:  the product listing description places flavor range as mostly fruit, supported by floral scope, which isn't what I've interpreted it as here.  When the two themes mix in a tea it can be hard to sort out which provides more input, and what you expect can factor into judgment.  If I had read that description prior to tasting I'd have been discussing fruit tones, but without that it seemed essentially entirely floral to me.  The character would have changed a little over 3 1/2 years; it's hard to factor that in.

Lishan:  nuttiness is pronounced again.  There would be different ways to interpret that; others may not see this as tasting like nuts, and it's not exactly like nuts, just in that general range (cashews, I guess, or maybe macadamia nuts instead, or in the middle).  There is floral range as well.  

I'm not noticing even a hint of vegetal range, maybe related to brewing it so much lighter, but the mineral layer is still a bit savory.  It comes across as less full and rich in relation to the first tea really dialing up that range, but that's partly related to a comparison effect, not a gap in aspects.  I could imagine someone like either one of these more than the other, but to me the first is nicer, related to getting back to experiencing that really dialed up floral range experience again.  Pleasant mineral base, rich feel, and long aftertaste support that.

Bi Yu #3:  it would work to brew these lightly, using half the proportion that I am, and still moderate infusion times, and intensity would still be fine.  Nah; I'm dialing it up.  At least I am only brewing these for 15 seconds or so, but at this proportion that brews a strong infusion.  I think some of that relates to acclimating to young sheng intensity, which is hard to moderate, no matter how you brew it, so brewing oolongs or other teas lightly just seems thin to me.

Richness really stands out this round, and the floral tone picks up a bit of warmth, taking on a perfume-like character.  Or that also reminds me of cognac or brandy, one part of that range of experience, which I've not been through in decades, since I barely drink any alcohol, a few beers a year.  

Floral tone is heavier.  Someone more capable of describing two dozen distinct floral tone inputs would be offering a different list of them this round.  More like lavender?  Intensity has been great through all these rounds, and that's the same, it's amazing.

Lishan:  those earlier aspects settle and integrate in an interesting way.  It won't really work to describe how, exactly what I mean by that.  The nutty range is less distinct as that kind of form, and a base of what seems like less clearly defined vegetal range picks up, like a green wood tone.  Floral range is still pronounced.  It all integrates as one pleasant and unified experience more than it must sound.  Decent sweetness and bright intensity makes it work, along with a significant mineral base.  Again it seems less rich in feel with less aftertaste expression, but that's mostly in comparison with the other version.

It's interesting that the wet leaf appearance is so much greener for this version than the other, and darker.  Based on reviewing the listings (later) it's from the oxidation level being higher for the Bi Yu version, but that Lishan version seems extra green somehow, so deep and dark.

Bi Yu #4:  the progressive warming transition continues; this may be drifting just a little towards a spice tone range.  It's not there yet; maybe next round that kind of shift will be more pronounced.  Again the heavier floral range is nice.

Lishan:  maybe just a touch "greener," or it could be that I'm looking for that, after the observation about the color.  I think it's actually there too.  It makes this come across as really rich in flavor in an unusual sense, not really similar to green tea character, but I suppose it wouldn't just be a stretch if someone wanted to draw some limited comparison.  The grassiness and astringency edge isn't there, but then green teas do vary quite a bit.  Maybe more like a more savory version of one, that lacks an astringency edge.

That green part reminds me of a fresh forest scent, as much as green wood, which is how I've described it earlier.  It's like that heavy vegetal scent after a spring rain.  I suppose drawing a parallel with moss might actually make sense; it's clear enough how the different themes I'm mentioning connect.  Moss does represent the greenest and dampest fresh floral tone range, integrated with heavy mineral range.

Going back and re-trying the other version after this one the warming tones in the Bi Yu might be shifting a little towards a green wood tone, more of an actual version of that, not something comparable but different.

Bi Yu #5:  I think drinking this on the hot side emphasizes a connection to spice tone, and then in a few minutes once it cools that green wood link will stand out as much.  That's a subject I don't ever do much with, variations in drinking tea at different temperatures.  

Often I'll use two cups for making tea Gongfu style with breakfast, pouring it from one to the other one time per round, to absorb more of the heat.  I'm using a larger set of cups to prepare these, so they're drinkable right away related to temperature, but not so cool.

Lishan:  more of the same, really.  It's interesting how those heavy flavors combine, not so clearly linked to nuts range now (macadamia mostly, I guess), but combining a few dominant layers.  It's pleasant for how well it all integrates and works together.  And it helps that there are no aspects that seem like flaws, which it's easy to not explicitly notice.  

The other version is just a touch sweeter, richer in feel, and includes more aftertaste experience, but that's not really a flaw, just more positive supporting range associated with the first tea.  I suppose that someone could interpret those as "quality markers," and see it as indicated as higher in quality, but it's hard for me to conclusively conclude that.  They're just different in style.

Later rounds:  these kept going and going, of course.  In later rounds the Bi Yu faded to become thinner in profile, with more emphasis on the heavy mineral layer.  The Lishan stayed quite positive, lightening up across aspect scope except for sweetness, bright floral range, and rich feel (so forest scent / vegetal range and the mineral layer dropped out, put the other way).  It was interesting for a tea to fade in the end while retaining the most positive aspect range; usually they'll pick up a woodiness, or settle on more mineral range.

Conclusions:

It's interesting not noticing fruit from the Bi Yu vendor description, it just seeming floral.  And interesting that the version really held its own with the Lishan up until later rounds, after which the Lishan continued on as more positive.  How to place that?

One might conclude that the Lishan is a higher quality level tea, or instead that the effects of higher oxidation level and roast input lent themselves to being more positive in earlier rounds, and then to the Bi Yu version fading quicker.  Maybe it's both.

For sheng pu'er, or even for other tea types, it's easier for me to place how the different types of aspects get sorted out according to somewhat conventional preferences, from discussion of teas online, or related to vendor input.  Are the heavy green forest scent / moss aspect or macadamia nut richness in the Lishan version highly desirable characteristics, or is that negative, or neutral?  I suppose preference should really dictate that, since specific flavors don't typically serve as "quality markers."  Something like richness of feel or extended aftertaste are more often regarded as universally positive. 

It would be nice if I'd kept up more contact with rolled oolong scope, and I could do better with placing these on a general quality scale, or commenting further on value.  At a guess they're quite good, matching up well with teas sold as of exceptional quality, and 30-some and 60-some cents a gram are very fair price ranges, for what they are.  For as pleasant as this Bi Yu version is that's probably a good value, as good rolled oolong goes, but then in a different sense that could easily also be true of the other Lishan version.  

Origin area is one main input to demand level, across many tea types, and you end up paying more for what other people tend to seek out and value.  Then styles and quality level can be more variable across less demanded range, so you have to be careful about what you explore, or some experiences won't match preferences and expectations.

Looking at their Taiwanese oolong page they carry a lot of versions.  It would be tough to pick and choose among them on a tightly limited budget.  Some might seem better than others, varying with preference, but at least of what I've tried of Tea Mania versions they've all been pretty solid, with no "misses."  That would happen, if a vendor is sharing their favorite versions as samples, but I was in the habit of buying tea from them every year awhile back, before I moved on to focusing on Thai and Vietnamese teas more recently, and all that I tried was quite nice.  

You do experience more misses when exploring off-main-production-area teas, and styles vary more, so you pay a price for buying teas at lower rates.  To me that variation is nice too though, experiencing what you don't expect.