Kokang 2018 Myanmar sheng; meeting the producer

I just met some of the staff from the Kokang Myanmar based producer at an expo (sales convention) this past weekend, and tried their 2006 sheng earlier that day; it will be a good time to keep going and review a younger version.  The first half of this post is a review, with the second covering ideas they shared there at the event.

Paging around their website and Facebook page doesn't turn up a lot beside some direct contacts, general background, and shared images, with this inner tea label filling in details along those lines:

Sounds good.  I generally take specific tea-tree age claims with a grain of salt, and they practiced some restraint in not even going there in this label.  There are really old tea trees throughout Yunnan (of course), Myanmar, and Northern Thailand, Laos, and Vietnam, so to some extent whatever age range people cite as a source-plant age could be partially justified.  It's probably also true that growers aren't out there in the forests scattering chemical fertilizers and spraying pesticides, that the vegetation in those environments has reached its own natural balance long ago.

Technically this isn't pu'er since that tea-type name is registered as restricted to Yunnan, but then this part of Myanmar was a part of China at one point before that restriction was ever in effect.  Locally it must have a different name in their local language.  As I take naming conventions it still is sheng, because the Chinese didn't register the modifier of it being "raw," as far as I know.

Full disclosure:  they did provide these teas for review (many thanks!).  I was going to buy some too, given the pleasant tasting experience and very fair pricing, which I'll skip citing here since it may have related to a promotional offering at that expo event, only discussing relative quality level and value in general terms at one point.

Review:

The dry leaf scent is sweet, bright, and rich.  In brewing the tea the scent of rinsed leaves is very sweet, with a strong honey-like smell.  I'll only pass on some first impressions from the first round (and I guess carried over from trying it two days ago) since it's not where it will be when fully wet.

It's sweet, light, and bright.  Bitterness doesn't develop much so early on but that will kick in.  That honey flavor is pleasant, joined by still non-distinct floral, fruit, and mineral range.  This is mostly floral but a light and dry version of mineral stands out already.  Even for being a bit light the feel structure is nice and aftertaste lingers, both so intense the tea experience doesn't diminish after you swallow.


This second round was brewed for a relatively short time, under 10 seconds, and it's still a bit intense.  Until the infusions lose intensity a half dozen rounds in, or later, using a 5 second time would work better.  It's not overbrewed in the sense of being unpleasant, or hard to appreciate or evaluate, just stronger than I prefer.

In that 2006 version review I'd mentioned how a mineral aspect reminded me of one in Vietnamese Thai Nguyen teas, a light and dry but relatively intense mineral aspect that seemed to tie to a vegetal range along the line of kale.  That's present in this too.  Sweetness stands out the most, warm like honey, and pronounced floral tone after that, and then next that mineral.  There is bitterness but that level balances reasonably well; it's still moderate.  It helps that I've been drinking an awful lot of sheng for the past year and a half; helping with interpreting a significant level of bitterness as "moderate," and enjoying that in the right balance.

This is probably not that far off the last version Noppadol passed on, which was a very positive tea (and one he gave me a sample of last year was as well).  I tried that first version again in the last two weeks, even though he gave it to me half a year ago now; I tend to drink the teas I don't like as much quickly and then hold onto the ones I do.  Backwards, right?  At some point to get the most out of them I need to share them, since me having the same experience again seems to add less value than someone else experiencing them.

Feel and aftertaste stand out in experiencing this; I've not done that part justice.  It's sweet to begin with, while you are still drinking it, but after you swallow that bitterness crosses over to a pronounced experience of sweetness.  I've largely given up communicating where tea feel-structure impacts your mouth, but this feels full throughout, with a good bit of structure coming across all across the rear of your tongue, mouth, and throat.  The feel isn't as rich, oily, and full but still soft as can occur but it's pleasant, not dry or harsh in any way.

leaves still unfurling; color a bit darker for being in shadow

Brewed quite quickly the balance works really well.  Somehow it's even sweeter; the flavor intensity in this is impressive.  Per splitting that to taste (as experienced by the mouth) and aroma / fragrance (as picked up in the rear nasal passages, as aromatic components) that sweetness is a taste, as the even more limited bitterness is, but the tea is also fragrant.  The floral range is very nice; that may even trail over to a bit of dried sweet fruit, like a light version of dried mango (of course there are lots of species of those).

The only negative might relate to someone not loving that form of mineral, which works for me.  Again it's pronounced, just not as much as the sweetness and floral range, a dry mineral (eg. limestone) trailing into a hint of vegetal range.  For the right green tea lover this tea could be ideal, although the bitterness may not match expectations or ideal preference.  Bitterness level drops a lot in comparison with the rest brewed lightly, so even though the balance in the last round worked ok for me this is much better.  It's a beautiful tea; it's easy to appreciate how good this is, how distinctive, and the quality level these experienced attributes represent.  Just not necessarily for someone at the start of their sheng journey; avoiding bitterness as much as possible early on might work better for many, and this might not be perceived as balancing well related to that.


A bit of a tangent, but it makes me consider how this will age.  It's more than intense enough to not simply fade over a normal span of limited aging, and could surely hold up to a long cycle, but being as approachable as it is may not be the most positive sign.  Then again I think with this degree of flavor intensity, bitterness, and structure it might come out the other side of dozen years of moderately humid storage just fine.  I should try explaining that to my wife, related to picking up a tong.  I already need to go through a tea storage re-configuration just to quiet her threats of either throwing out the tea or me along with it.

There might be a moderate-age sweet-spot this tea goes through on the sooner side.  At one year old it will have lost a little of it's youthful bright character and intensity but also would have swapped out some bitterness and astringency.  It might be really nice within one to two more years as that exchange continues.  Some people do seem to love middle-aged sheng, drinking versions between 3 and 8 years along, which makes less sense to others.  It would depend on the tea, and the storage.


Next round more of the same; I don't remember this transitioning all that much in that expo tasting session.  The flavor of the honey seems slightly more pronounced; the profile has warmed a little.  That kale-range vegetable, which always was a minor aspect compared to the rest, seems to be transitioning to hardwood, a more typical profile.  Mineral might be easing up a little, letting the honey and floral really take over. 

That honey-like warm sweetness and rich, mild, but still-fragrant floral scent overlaps a little with Ya Shi (duck shit) Dan Cong character, just framed in a completely different context.  For a Dan Cong oolong lover this bitterness may well be way too much, and the level of mineral unfamiliar, or at least unpleasant.  For someone who loves a broad range of teas for different reasons--how I see my own case--both could be great.  I'm not saying this is the Ya Shi of sheng, that overall place and character map over, only that one set of two different flavor aspects does.

I'd had a tasting-environment complication of kids out here using the trampoline beside my outdoor tasting location but things have went quiet.  It's a nice day, early in the morning, warm but not hot yet; it's hard to appreciate good weather in Bangkok unless a cool edge to the feel triggers it.

trampoline jumping and messing with electronics; not ideal

selfie version, with laundry drying

The next round is more of the same; not such a bad thing.  It's soft enough now that messing around with longer infusion times might work but the intensity is still definitely there brewed light.  I love the character of this tea but brewing transitions also relate to not drinking exactly the same thing 10 rounds in a row, experiencing that extra dimension.  That trade-out within the next year or two of aging might compensate for that, adding some other range that could evolve throughout an infusion cycle, along with trading out a lot of what is already present.  This tea definitely has sweetness and floral intensity to spare.

Wood tone picks up a little brewing it slightly longer next round.  It's still pleasant, still not completely different than it had been, but this seems to be the early part of it fading.  People who throw in the towel after the character changes to be slightly less positive might call it quits here; for others who would rather experience more a tea can offer could keep going for awhile.  To me it's still very nice; the overall balance is good.


All in all a very nice tea.  It can't be judged related to the price they were asking at a wholesale oriented sales expo but for value related to that factor it's an incredible tea.  This may not be on the same level as $1 / gram Yunnan gushu versions, related to sought-after character aspects unique to limited areas, but it shares some of the same scope for what it is, definitely at least an upper middle-level quality sheng version.  What I mean by that isn't that it's above average as factory sheng goes, an above average version of the entire category range beyond that instead.  Of course personal preference related to aspects and demand for tea related to location shift things, across a broad scope of how good it is and where a fair market price would be.

beautiful fully opened brewed leaves

2006 version.  much more broken, but almost the same color!

I'm tempted to compare it to that 2006 version, to say which I liked better.  At this point it's a bit of a toss-up because they're just so different in style, positive in completely different ways.  I think in 2 to 3 years that older version will be really nice, properly through it's fermentation transitions, or at least enough to bring that potential across, after steaming in Bangkok heat for that time.  This 2018 version doesn't necessarily need bitterness or astringency to drop out to be approachable but it may be just as pleasant in a different way at that time, and may also have good long-term potential, just based on starting in a different place (probably).

I like both, but the other is more interesting for being unique, and this version better for seeming a higher quality tea version, ticking more boxes related to how young sheng should be.  For whatever personal preference reasons I'm most drawn to sheng versions inclined towards fruit range, so this doesn't match my own best-case profile, but for the character range it covers it's quite nice.

Related to value, the price I bought the 2006 version for and what this 2018 cake were selling for were both amazing.  It often comes up trying to place if teas selling for $60-$80 per standard size cake amount (357 grams) really justify that upper-medium range of pricing, with a jump from there straight to $1 a gram for those presented as gushu.  Both of these were priced nowhere near that middle-range level but they hold their own for positive character.  From there supply and demand kick in though; putting "Yiwu gushu" on a cake links it to established high demand, especially if the source reliability implies that it really is that.

nice representatives (the one not wearing a badge was fellow visitor)

At the expo:

I can pass on some of what I remember the Kokang representatives mentioning at that expo, but of course I didn't use a recorder or take notes, so some of that recollection could be a bit off.


How old are the tea trees?

As good a place as any to start.  Of course they cited lots of different ages; some 200-300 years old, some younger or older.  It's my understanding that tea plants came to countries like Myanmar, Northern Thailand, Laos, and Vietnam a very long time ago, and tea-tree age estimation is imprecise, so no one would really know for sure, short of calling in a biologist.  These teas are from the Shan state, where other versions I've tried from a local vendor friend (Noppadol) has passed some on, of course the region bordering China.  I should've asked about the conflicts there but got side-tracked talking about tea instead.



How long have they been making shu?

Not so long, starting in 2015.  This question occurred to me related to trying a pretty good shu from Myanmar relatively recently, a Tea Side version, and related to trying their 2006 version of Kokang sheng.  The one representative visiting, Maung Lwin, was described by another as a 5th generation tea producer (referenced on their website page), so apparently involved with the production and business ownership as his family has been for a long time. 

I'll review that shu before too long, and did try it there already, so I have a relatively clear impression of it now.  It was good; a bit mild and subtle, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.  It might've been less fermented than some, which makes you wonder if it wouldn't have more potential related to aging and transitioning more over a longer time period.


In reference to why the teas are less smoky now.

The one representative showed pictures of lots of very large woks processing the leaves, all with smoke contained in isolation housings that ventilate the fires' smoke away from the tea, eliminating potential contact with the tea.  It makes sense that some of the flavor in teas (sheng) could be some version of natural smoke flavor (just how the tea happens to taste), but also that contact with smoke during processing and storage would also be a factor.  The idea comes up that it's not difficult to tell the difference between the two, and who knows, maybe with the right exposure that would go well.  I have trouble separating the input distinctions I think I can make from those that are actually reliable.

The effect from smoke contact would probably vary a lot though, depending on the form that contact took, type of wood, etc.  This sheng definitely isn't smoky, which already came up in the review.

they also produce dragonballs (not clearly identifiable in this, on the right)

Can people buy the teas online directly from them?

My impression is that they're just not set up for that, based on their response, and reviewing the website bears that out.  They must sell the tea but seem to not be using a direct retail sales model.  I bought an old version from another vendor (the Chawang Shop, an online outlet in Kunming), and someone mentioned another vendor selling that same tea elsewhere, so it's around.  This might make their teas a perfect opportunity for resale back in the US, since although they're not set up for selling a couple of cakes and samples they must be able to sell larger volumes.  They were at this expo to meet resellers to distribute at wholesale volumes, so now could be the perfect time for that.


Are the teas organic?

We didn't discuss this in the form of them guaranteeing that they are, but we did related to the perceived importance of certifications.  They implied that all the teas are naturally grown, without the use of chemical fertilizers or pesticides, but of course if they are producing a broad range of different products from differently sourced leaf material there seems a chance that inputs could vary.  The label print reminds me of this point (the one I posted an image of earlier):

"...grown in Northeastern Shan State in Myanmar, altitude mountain sea level at around 1800 to 2000 meters, never applied pesticides, chemical fertilizers..."


They specifically mentioned that the black tea they produce is from different plant material from a different area, so it may be that the claims and background don't carry over to those.  The black tea was ok, interesting and pleasant if not as complex as it might be.  It was really pleasant in terms of fragrance, but then a separate review will tell that story better.

I really appreciated the opportunity to meet and talk to them, and experiencing the teas has been a wonderful experience.  I think I'll appreciate the shu and black tea all the more for having a chance to mess around with brewing parameters, since to me if you infuse sheng fast and light at a high proportion that works well, but for those others varying inputs makes a lot of difference.

A Bangkok tea expo; gateways to tea

Bangkok tea expo (media event image from the Impact arena, photo credit)

I attended a Bangkok tea expo at the Impact event arena over the weekend, the second time I've been to that one, and the second such event this year.  It was really a coffee and tea theme, combined with foods, but there wasn't much going on related to tea.  Unfortunately that will be the main theme of this post, that tea-themed expos in Bangkok don't amount to much.  I'll add some about what is going on with tea, related to what I saw, which will fill in some background.

SNSS local Ceylon vendor

At that expo I saw a local business contact who I ran across at last year's event, the Chai Dim owner, and a Ceylon vendor I met for a tasting earlier this year.  Other than matcha, and commercial Thai tea that sells in grocery stores that was about it.  I'm not really into matcha but I almost bought some, just to participate.  I've tried real matcha a number of times, and Starbucks latte level versions more, and ice cream and smoothies, but it's sort of an acquired taste, like beer or coffee, and I've not acquired it yet.  Which I'm ok with.  I don't love green tea so it's not the best natural fit.  I was into adding spirulina to protein drinks when I was a vegetarian (which lasted a bit shy of 20 years, not a short stint), so I have the potential for that range, but my tea habit is enough ground to cover without it.

Chai Dim vendor booth

Where to go with saying I barely drank any tea there?  I can describe what I did try.  I tried a Wuyi Yancha Shui Xian that was ok, not great, but decent for commercial tea.  And I tried a SNSS Ceylon hot brewed tea that was fine, typical for those, better than what one buys in a grocery store, and a version they had prepared with milk and sugar.  That was probably the one interesting high point, tasting milky tea in a range that wasn't completely familiar.  It was good, with enough flavor range it almost seemed like flavored-tea versions, except it was that mineral-intensive and earthy Ceylon range natural flavor.  Still sweetened milky tea though.


At last year's version I first met those two vendors I mentioned and tried a Nespresso machine version of Thai flavored tea, and drank a bit of local Thai tea, and a Dilmah brand sample (decent commercial Ceylon tea, if one is into such things).  Not much going on in comparison this year; the same, just less.


So that's it:  the story of a Bangkok tea expo is that there wasn't much tea there.  I went to a different coffee and tea specific expo version not too long ago and walked back out without seeing an equivalent of those two booths I said some about here.  I tried some watery, warm matcha there or else I'd have not have tasted anything.  Even though it was awful it filled in the experience, a little.

I've been to an organic foods event here in town that's had more tea selection than both events; it really seemed the "coffee and tea" sub-theme would draw out more showing than it did.  At least I bought some cashews, and sausages, and milk-candy for my kids on the walk back out through a different section.

SNSS Ceylon display; I have some tea to review later

Beyond the expo, other related discussion

at the Jip Eu Chinatown shop, looking a little somber

I met another vendor in town for different reasons, Kenneth of Monsoon teas in Chiang Mai, at my favorite Chinatown shop this weekend, Jip Eu.  We talked a little about what he was into (the short version:  wild, sustainable, other-related-plant-type based tea development).  Really that's not as distinct a subject as it might seem.


In one Facebook tea group a long discussion just reviewed how closely Taliensis--another Camellia Sinensis variety--is related to the other two standard branches.  The short answer:  who knows (but different research papers do give longer answers).  And I just reviewed a Yabao tea buds product that seems to be from a plant type that's not exactly the same as those in the other two main branches (Dehongensis instead, although what that is isn't clear).


We were sitting in one of the best places to pick up Wuyi Yancha in Bangkok, maybe the best, and tried a really nice Da Hong Pao there.  Of course "nice" is always relative; probably as good as nicer online shops tend to sell, maybe not quite as good as the average tea version pitched as being in the "never makes it out of China" range.  That Bei Dou I bought from them awhile back probably was on that level, just crazy how pleasant and well balanced (reviewed here).


All that aside, I asked him how it might work to get people into better tea, and his answer was simple:  gateway teas (not how he put it, but how I tend to think of it).  Flavored teas and blends, to be more specific.  On the one hand that's a solid, completely intuitive answer that matches lots of people's experiences.  I started out on tisanes 25 years ago, and maybe only got into normal teas because of that, partly by way of trying out Tazo blends around 20 years ago.


Bit of a tangent, but it makes you wonder how long Tazo has even been around (23 years, per the Wikipedia entry, probably with more on that somewhere on their website).  I had no idea I was an early adopter.  Really I just tried a lot of their line since a restaurant in Colorado carried it, within the first few years the brand even existed, it would seem.  I remember drinking a health-inspired blend from a local health-foods shop called "Immuni-tea" back then; that was an interesting idea to develop a functional blend (even if the validity might be questionable), and got in early with that range of tea puns, but as I recall it tasted a bit nasty.

Peony tea shop in Silom; mostly about blends (2015 photo)

Others experienced or are still experiencing something similar through Teavana, or David's tea, or by trying Twinings versions, or whatever else comes up.  T2 seems to have dumbed down their selection from years ago, probably in part related to being bought by Unilever, but one can only assume the blends sell (or at least the profit margin is good).  Here in Thailand you see mostly bottled (RTD, ready to drink) Japanese theme tea, bubble tea, or Thai tea (spiced black tea, served cold with milk and sugar, the orange one).  Plain black tea with sweetened condensed milk isn't exactly the same but not so different.



Of course a tea enthusiast might well think people don't need to go through all that, they could go straight from a Starbucks coffee habit to any number of plain-tea entry points.  Light oolong (Thai versions) was one of my own, but I'd been drinking green tea in Japanese restaurants before that, and buying an unusual Laos farmer-produced version was another stepping stone.  So was jasmine green tea.  Earl Grey not so much, but that was the luck of the draw, if that restaurant in Colorado had carried it in addition to Zen and the rest maybe the process would have went faster.


At the expo the Chai Dim vendor was saying the same thing; he started selling a whole line of blends in the past year.  That one Shui Xian was the exception, the only plain tea loose he sold (as I remember), with a smoked Lapsang Souchong as a standard flavored alternative.  I probably should've tried that; the smoke balance in versions almost never matches my preferences but I could probably still get into smoked tea if it did.  I reviewed a smoked tea from Japan that was nice not long ago, it just didn't lead me to searching for more, at least just yet.

food and beverage expo meets car show  (photo credit)

Where does that leave plain tea

Would a better plain tea booth at that expo had worked?  Maybe; it would probably depend on the format.  End-customers can and do go to those events but it's more focused on other vendors, so the vending theme would have to be right.  The image would need to sell, to an extent, along with the teas themselves.  The same awareness problems that factor in for end-customer sales also applies to other vendors.

These are issues I've been giving a lot of thought to.  This market is where the US tea market probably was 20 years ago, definitely establishing an opportunity for the right approach.  But then surely lots of US tea vendors have failed in the last 20 years, or continued with businesses that aren't clearly successful.  Awareness on the customer side has to be one factor; the most promising development on the supply side means nothing without the teas being desired and purchased.  The main difference is that Northern Thailand was growing tea 1000 years ago, and a wave of Chinese immigrants (Tai people--long story) were responsible for establishing the Sukhothai kingdom and era right around 1238 (with lots more on that here).  That shop I was in has been around for about a century but that's quite recent compared to the roots of Chinese tea here.


Again and again I post about vendors that are chipping away at the problem, building up awareness and demand in Thailand, but the conditions are just as much a recipe for failed businesses as an opportunity.  I suppose I have more ideas for potential directions than I've shared here but the root of the problem is that although tea awareness isn't non-existent interest in better tea is very, very limited.  There are vendors selling them but people aren't buying them, and online options don't need to be in-country, teas ship from place to place easily.  I've had one idea for a new approach that is truly novel, something I've been biting my tongue about, related to the potential for a darker side of marketing to emerge.  I'll say more about it if I ever see it happening.


There are Thai teas being sold here, of course.  Thai oolong is sold in grocery stores, or in small shops all over the place, or Royal Project stores, and online, in lots of places.  There are closer connections to other Asian countries than in the West, so you can visit Chinatown for tea, or walk into a Vietnamese restaurant and probably pick up some low-end green tea.  It doesn't seem to be serving as a gateway, and I'm not completely sure why not.  Unless you count about one new tea-themed cafe starting up in Bangkok per year, including branches, and then it is on the rise, but that's going to take time to build up to much.  I'll walk by 8 or so booths selling bubble tea or instant tea on the way to the BTS after work (elevated train system); at this rate it will never be on remotely the same level of popularity.

on the way back home from that event; way outside of Bangkok looks like this

The Bangkok World of Coffee and Tea Expo

I've seen notices for tea and coffee exhibitions in the past, and always intended to check one out, but only now finally did (the World of Coffee and Tea Expo).  Expos are common here in Bangkok, just an unusual version of a sales event, held in huge conference centers based on all sorts of themes.  We've been to similar ones related to electronics, baby goods, books, and travel.  It's not so similar to the tea conventions people frequent in the US, not focused on just that one theme, and this was just one third of a huge event covering a lot of additional food scope. To make a long story short, the scope was limited but some interesting things came up.

Chang beer!  But I wasn't there for that.

I did go to an organic foods event once that had a dozen stalls with people brewing and serving samples of tea, so I expected more of the same.  Novelty in tea selection is limited in general in Thailand, and I didn't expect a lot of foreign-originated sales to be part of it.  I'll describe some of what was there by vendor, easier for a reader to follow.  When first walking in it looked like any other expo, noisy, with lots of people and lots of presentations, and an amusing use of presenter "pretties" to sell all sorts of things.

Dilmah, commercial Ceylon teas

I must be joking, right?  These teas are sold in grocery stores, essentially no different than Twinings (not all of which is crappy tea-bag tea).  I kind of am, but I wasn't seeing a lot of tea when I first walked around, lots more elaborate coffee sales and brewing equipment, and I started to get nervous that this vendor might be what I came to see.  I didn't stop at their presentation area at first, and really did find a few more interesting places before stopping by here to check it out.


Of course they have a broad range of flavored tea-bag teas, none of any interest to me, but in the past I've tried slightly better loose tea from them.  It was still nothing novel or above average, still the kind of tea you need either milk or sugar added to get down, to soften the astringent character.  Taken with milk and sugar their loose tea is much better than Lipton's tea bags, but that's sort of beside the point.


They had a nice demonstration display that seemed to show the other kinds of teas I'd actually be interested in, better loose teas, but they weren't preparing samples of those.  They asked if I'd like to try a pomegranate flavored iced tea (I think it was--something fruity), which I declined.  Looking around some of their loose tea could've been ok, types like Tie Kuan Yin, which they said was also from Sri Lanka.  It would seem odd if the loose Lapsang Souchong and Darjeeling they were selling were also from that country, but we didn't discuss that.  I would guess that they do make teas that the average loose tea drinker really could appreciate, maybe even better Ceylon teas that they would love to have a chance to drink, but I just wasn't seeing it there.


They did give me a tea-bag version of a Ceylon oolong to try, my first, I think.  It wasn't great, and didn't taste like much at all.  I had a Thai oolong sample that I was carrying around to compare it to (Boon Rawd, a commercial producer here, but one that at least makes reasonable loose teas).  That was a light oolong served in a pyramid-style tea-bag, much better than the oolong dust in the Dilmah tea bag, not that I needed a comparison tasting to place either.  I dumped most of the hot water from the Dilmah cup into the Boon Rawd sample cup to get one more infusion out of that bag, which probably would've went at least one more.

Boon Rawd, commercial volume Thai tea maker / plantation

This was what I was expecting to find; a tea maker producing decent lightly oxidized oolongs, teas I'd appreciate more if I'd not already tried a thousand of them.  They also sold flavored teas, and some herbal teas (tisanes, to some), not that I was interested in that.  There's not much more to tell; that one oolong was nice, but not nice enough it stuck in my mind which type it was (Jin Xuan, Four Seasons, etc.; I think the latter).

As for contact they have a website, but for English language a related article might work better, although there isn't much there.  That says they produce 400 tons of tea a year, a good bit, and this blog post says they have a restaurant at their farm.  A visit might be nice but I wouldn't expect much for any better quality specialty teas.

I thought I'd tried decent osmanthus oolong from them before, one of the few floral infused teas I'd find it worthwhile to drink, but now I'm remembering it was from this other commercial producer instead.  That previous floral infused tea was nice but not interesting enough for me to try another sample of one at the expo.  So there wasn't much to report.  If they make a next level of better tea that would be news to me, but at least decent commercial loose teas are a nice gateway offering, a leap forward from what people sell as lemon tea or milk tea (adulterated low-grade black tea).

Specialized Ceylon Tea Supplier for Wholesale and retail  (SNSS)

Nice to see something slightly different; a vendor selling a broader range of Sri Lankan teas.  I tried a few; they were fine.  Better Sri Lankan / Ceylon tea can be something of a revelation, but this was just pretty good.  I tried a range of their black teas and a green tea, and bought the better black tea they had on offer.  It was an amazing value, 100 baht or around $3 for a small amount of tea, surely enough to brew a dozen cups worth though.  If I only liked standard Assamica black teas more I'd have bought the larger size, a really nice tea to have for daily drinking, but not so much if you prefer other styles.

The most interesting tea they carried, a golden tips, they didn't have with them.  Staff said it was unavailable due to limited production due to flooding in Sri Lanka.  Too bad.  They had two white teas in their product line-up, including another more like a silver needle, and that was it besides the broad range of black tea types.  Most of those I wouldn't be interested in, ground teas or finer broken leaf versions, but the one I tried was probably better black tea than most casual drinkers know exists.  That's not really a high bar to clear for specialty tea, but they were well over it.  I guess I could do a review of this tea since I have some to keep trying, but otherwise that covers it for them.

Big Eye Coffee, Nespresso compatible coffee maker compatible tea cartridges

Something different, to me at least.  I've had Thai tea prepared in espresso machines before, so it's not a brand new idea for me, but interesting to see it go the next step.  It took forever to get them to make me a sample, with a language hang-up finally emerging (my Thai is ok for taxi directions, not good for talking through tea tasting).  I had a tough choice:  compare what I'd already tried related to Thai tea, since I'd have a baseline for how that would be, or try something else (there were a few tea types).  I went with Thai tea.

Of course it was a bit astringent.  Thai tea is normally prepared with milk and sugar, usually referring to a black tea (traditionally Assamica) mixed with different herbs.  In modern forms star anise is prominent, but I've read that there were earlier versions; see this related post.


It was ok, nothing special, the process worked.  It would work better if the tea were served with sugar and milk, how Thais take it, almost always iced.  I never did find out if the other teas would be ok or not since I waited 10 to 15 minutes to get that sample, and with my Thai barely enabling me to request a sample I wasn't going to wow anyone by claiming a privileged status as a tea blogger.  Even without a language gap maybe that would've met with a blank look.

At least it's nice to know some coffee drinkers might find it easier to mix dry leaves and hot water, even if a 15 second brew of ground up tea using boiling hot water probably wouldn't work out as well as dumping the leaves and water in a coffee cup for a few minutes.


Related to cost, their website shows these sell for 135 baht for 10 capsules (about $4), on sale from 150 baht.  Obviously that's a much better deal than Starbucks, the same price as one cup of coffee for 10, and a good trade-up for people buying mixed powdered teas for 30 baht / $1 each.  It looks like those machines cost 2600 to 3900 baht ($80 to $120), but that could save people a lot of money if they could kick a coffee shop habit.


It's a bit of a tangent, but in a sense I really don't get powdered tea.  It is a bit like a chocolate milk version of tea, decent for what it is, so it makes just a little sense, but it's not so much like normal tea, definitely a missed opportunity to drink something much better.  I also don't get people being too lazy to make it themselves, since you pay more for someone to stir powder in water and put it in a plastic cup.  I guess that includes the benefit of participating in what Starbucks started, everyone walking around with their drink in the morning, or whenever, and maybe there is some reason why leaving the house with it doesn't work out. 

Chaidim Specialty Thai tea vendor

It's almost as if I went to this event to meet this guy / vendor, since this was the only specialty tea producer offering unique products there.  I might also include that one Ceylon vendor, since you won't find decent Ceylon in a grocery store or tea shop in Bangkok.  The owner was at the booth, Nedhim Behar, originally from Turkey (cool enough, right?).  He was mostly pitching tea and herb blends, not an unheard of thing here, lemongrass and ginger tisanes or mixes.  Those are nice in their own regards, just not really my thing.  But they did have some decent Thai oolong.

Dong Ding style oolong; looks about right

After trying a nice lightly oxidized oolong--so boring, given that overexposure I already mentioned--I tried a medium oxidized style oolong, a Dong Ding style tea, if that makes more sense (as described in this post).  It was nice; a good feel to it, a good bit of cinnamon, clean flavors, with a decent balance; it really worked.  There was a time when a regional designation applied like that would seem odd to me, but if you mentally add the word "style" it's back to being perfectly fine, so probably as well not to sweat that part.  But then pu'er-style teas sound more interesting as hei cha or dark tea, so maybe it's as well to not use that approach for those.


In retrospect I probably should have asked about buying it, but we got to talking about lots of tangents and then he was busy so I only grabbed the row of sample pyramid-style bag versions and went off.  I could easily say this was the best truly mid-oxidized version of a Thai tea I've tried, but no others come to mind, except one tea that stood out for me hating it, a tea with an off chemical taste.  They just don't do that style here.  I've tried Thai versions of Oriental Beauty (Tea Side and Tea Village vendors sell versions), and that oxidation level is medium, but it's really a different thing.  If more comes up to say about that tea I'll do a separate post, but I'll switch it over to those tangents that I mentioned here.

Dong Ding-style, a little oxidized

The owner, Nedhim, was working on a project to make a version of hojicha, more or less, still sorting out roasting methodology.  It seemed like it needed some tweaking still, that the char was too much, but it's nice when people have cool and innovative ideas that really will work and then they make it happen.  The catch might be building up a demand, but if people are going to be drinking low-grade fairly awful Wuyi Yancha as restaurant tea then they may as well bump that up to a drinkable hojicha variation.  I know, different origins, different flavor profile, probably different restaurants, but to me a comparison makes sense.  If you could try the restaurant-grade Shui Xian I've tried alongside a hojicha it might make sense to you too, or maybe not.


We talked about Thai organic standards, initiated by him selling teas that are certified to US and European organic standards instead.  He said that the US and European standards are more strictly controlled, with much better testing regimens for their certification processes (who would have thought).  The rest of the discussion about organic growing went where you would expect, pros and cons of going that route (teas that are healthier, versus lower production levels, with the added demands of establishing a natural growing environment).

He said that one problem with growing teas organically is that it doesn't really work to mix the two growing styles in a limited area, an interesting line of thought.  One farmer could be spraying chemicals that cross the road to land in the next farm.  It also doesn't mix well having an organic growing environment trying to balance a complete life-cycle of insects and other birds and insects that eat those insects, with the conventional farm trying to wipe out that layer of ecosystem nearby.  Yeah, organic is better.  I wonder how much risk there really is from consuming those chemicals, and I'm not hopeful or naive enough to guess that it's probably none.

As far as cost and offerings of products, the website lists those at retail level.  That Dong Ding style tea costs the same as the others, and at $11 for 50 grams (350 baht; funny translating it back that direction instead), which seems like a pretty good value to me.  The lighter oolongs you might find comparable versions of in grocery stores or Royal Project shops, although many wouldn't be quite as good, but you could waste a lot of time figuring out that mid-roasted Thai oolongs don't come up.

From talking to Nedhim he seems to sell teas in different ways, so if someone wanted to buy kilograms for a different purpose that would probably work out.  For lighter oolongs a trip to the Chiang Rai area--where tea is made in Thailand--would turn up lots of other options, but again the mid-level oxidized and roasted tea might not be so easy to find, even there.

Chaho Japanese tea

One larger display are held Japanese tea dealer in Bangkok; lots of Japanese people live here.  This is a bit of an afterthought, since Japanese teas aren't my favorite.  I actually considered picking up some matcha, as any US based tea lover would have, but I've not acquired a taste for matcha yet, and I'm in no hurry to.  I've bought it before, and since I've participated in two formal Japanese tea ceremonies in the past I'd assume that I've tried ceremonial grade, but I don't naturally love it.  I'm sure if I tried matcha another dozen times I'd stand a chance of acquiring a preference for it, but I've got too much scope to cover now as it is.


I tried a genmaichai there (kind of random--what they had out), and noticed they had an interesting powdered version of hojicha, but it wasn't interesting enough for me to buy it.  I like the idea of hojicha, and the tea can be nice, but I like most other kinds of tea better, so it defeats some of the point of drinking it.  I saw hojicha soft serve ice cream here in a mall not too long ago and probably should have tried that since I'm still curious about it, but it will turn back up again.


I would expect this vendor to sell to commercial customers in addition to direct retail but I didn't discuss that.  Their website mentions some sort of outlet in Silom, near where I work, so that's something I could check out on a lunch break.  I always thought eventually I'd get back to Japanese teas more once I give Chinese teas more of a look, and pu'er has been high on the list but on hold for awhile (I've only tried a couple dozen, barely started as pu'er goes).  Then again I've had an intriguing introduction to teas from Nepal that requires more follow-up, and still haven't ran across better teas from Malaysia, or followed up on better versions from Laos, so maybe it's not time yet.

The rest of the event

Loud!  And crowded.  I only saw half, one of two halls holding the event, and sort of wondered about the other additional food displays event area, but not enough to go over there.  It's a shame that I'm not more interested in food.  I eat it, and I cook, and I'm slightly into regional foods across Asia that came up a lot there, with all sorts of booths covering most of what one could imagine of Asian foods, but I was a bit burned out on the noise and stimulus to try and take it all in.  It would seem to make more sense to only buy foods that weren't already in grocery stores, but such stores cover a lot of range here.  There were probably some really interesting gyoza or sausages or whatever on offer that I missed out on.

I was happy to find as much tea as I did, worth it heading way out to Impact, not really even in Bangkok, instead out in a suburb (Nonthaburi).  Tea awareness and demand here really isn't where coffee is yet, or else there would have been lots more to see and try.