Placing different kinds of tea vendors in relation to types

 

Over and over people ask online about others' favorite vendors, and one part that gets lost is that there are different kinds of vendors, with different focuses.  Value can vary a lot, and quality level of tea.  Range of what is available from each varies.  

I'm going to try to place different kinds of vendors by category, mostly through the lens of trying teas from a few sources in the past half a year.  I'll need to extend that, to get to other main types and source examples, because I've only bought tea from four sources this year, that come to mind (online; I keep buying tea from a favorite local Chinatown shop, mostly to give away, but also for myself).  That's a lot compared to last year; more than for the whole year.  Of course these aren't intended to represent optimum sources; they just match my own preferences.

Related to the Reddit tea vendors list capture, the image at the beginning, it's strange that there is only three categories there, for beginners, US sources, and teaware.  That leaves out most applicable range, for the rest of the world, and for everyone who isn't a beginner (although it still probably works for 90% of that sub / group).  It's interesting that one cited source, for beginners, mentions curated tea selling for 10 to 30 cents per gram.  That's something of a contradiction, for reasons this further content will describe.

I'll start with a couple main types of sources I didn't get to, and then move on to examples of what I've tried, and how I see those mapping to categories and other comparable source options.  There are pros and cons of using different kinds of sources, that relate to what someone is looking for, in terms of type / style, and value, which I'm describing as cost in relation to quality level.  

A relatively low quality version of tea can still be a great value, if selling for a very low and fair price.  Of course that's only if someone is ok with drinking that tea.  A really costly tea can still be a great value, if quality level, rarity, and market demand all support that it's worth it.  

To put a rough price range to that anything under 10 cents a gram is selling at the low end, for specialty tea.  Under 5 typically relates to a different quality range entirely, for mass-produced, pretty limited in quality tea versions.  You can generally buy really good quality, in-demand versions for 60 or 70 cents per gram, and it all levels off quite a bit around $1 / gram (which is the first reference to why "curated" tea selling for 30 cents a gram or less makes no sense; you can only curate the medium quality level range for that pricing, which is still pretty good tea, but "curation" implies that it's better than that).

This won't mostly be about evaluating value for different kinds of sources, but as I see it that's one main running theme, along with how good the teas actually are, and how unique the teas being offered are.  You can buy above average Anxi Tie Guan Yin from lots of places, or Jin Xuan rolled oolong in Thailand; this is mostly about teas that are more unique, and harder to find.

Places I don't shop

Online market outlets:  in the past Chawang Shop was sort of an exception to this, and I had great experiences buying tea from them.  Yunnan Sourcing is really the main example (and I've had positive experiences buying tea from them too).  King Tea Mall is a well-known and typically favorably regarded source, but according to some Yunnan Sourcing products may be a little more consistent.  King Tea Mall is probably buying and selling more online, and Yunnan Sourcing would use pretty well established upstream sources at this point, since they were already around 20 years ago, operating out of Kunming.

These kinds of vendors offer everything under the sun.  That's less true of Chawang Shop, but I'm using this categorization in a positive sense for them, claiming that they offer a broad range of tea types across a range of quality levels at decent value.  Here's an interesting in-house Jinggu shou pu'er I bought from Chawang Shop 4 years ago, probably not typical of what they sell, but then I'm claiming here that they sell different things, varying grades of sheng and shou, and hei cha, so in a sense it is.  That tea was unusually inexpensive ($15 for 400 gram brick), because they were selling it before it was settled (from fermentation funkiness) as a special offering, and you really need to hold onto it for a couple of years to get good results out of it.

Filtering related to what you want to find is a requirement, and there would be hits and misses, related to quality level and value.  Getting input from others through online group discussion could be helpful.  In the past text blogs or sites like Steepster filled this role, but now Discord discussion is probably more helpful.  Facebook is more or less dying, in relation to tea discussion, and Reddit tea subs tend to be stuck on people repeating the exact same beginner questions every single day. 

Especially related to Yunnan Sourcing the option to buy at sample quantity is a main benefit of using such a source type.  You can buy a couple of dozen samples for the same price as buying a lot of just a few kinds of tea, which you may not like.  Per gram value isn't as good, but it's not a great value buying a tea you don't want to drink.

It would sound as if I've moved on to narrow down sources that work even better for me, and I guess that's fair.

Higher end producer direct sites:  there aren't many of these.  Wuyi Origin is a main example, ran by a family member--as a frontperson--by Cindy Chen, selling great quality Wuyi Yancha, Fujian black tea, and Dan Cong, Chaozhou oolong.  Usually a source selling a broad range is a bad sign, because then they're typically just reselling wholesale outlet sourced teas, or else Taobao sourced versions, but that vendor has family in both places (Wuyishan, Fujian and Chaozhou, Guangdong).

I would buy tea from them, but I've drifted into preference for sheng pu'er.  It happens to people.  They're a fantastic source for really good quality oolong and black teas, which are great ranges for almost everyone.  But tea that good is on the costly side, typically above 30 or 40 cents per gram, with many at 60 or so.  That's still a great value, given that other "curator" sources would sell the same quality level versions for around $1 / gram instead.  

I did just buy tea from a Thai producer, which is another example of a different form of producer-direct sourcing, but I'll list that in the next section.

Gopaldhara is a good example of a Darjeeling garden that sells directly, both within India and outside it (through two different pages).  Their teas are exceptional; they fit the "higher end" description in this category heading.  There are other resale outlets that buy and distribute Indian teas, like Vahdam and Golden Tips, and those are ok too, but buying directly is generally better.  You can find better tea and better values.

really good first and second flush versions from Gopaldhara, reviewed in 2020

Curator sources:  there are a few different variations of these, and they kind of run together with ordinary broad type online sources.  A favorite I recommend is Trident Bookseller and Cafe, in Boulder.  They evolved to source award winning and otherwise amazing versions over time, to sell in-house, and eventually expanded that to limited online sales.  They don't push to expand volume, to contend with other larger outlets; it supplements their other business themes and income streams.

Value is great through them; for what they sell the pricing is really low.  That's only possible because they're a lot more producer direct than almost any other sources.  In a sense they're doing what Tealet had set out to do more than a decade ago, but left off at becoming just another wholesale vendor instead (which is fine; that's the model that ended up working).   I suppose their business model might be problematic, for ramping up volume and earnings.  Trying to sell the best teas at a good value would cut into your potential profit margin, and it might be hard to really ramp up volume.

Why do you never hear of a source like Trident then?  In part due to gatekeeping; people wouldn't mention it to help prevent ruining their own source.  In part because their existing consumer base is probably limited.  And then they don't use a lot of standard broad-form advertising to help with exposure, as a larger volume oriented source like Rishi does.

Other curator or specialty themed vendors are out there, but I can't mention any related to using them as a source.  Floating Leaves for Taiwanese oolongs gets mentioned as an example, but again I've not purchased anything from them.  A good quality curator source in the US would need to sell at high market value just to profit, so their teas would end up all being priced around $1 / gram, which I can't afford.  In terms of old-school, established outlets Tea Habitat has been a known Dan Cong vendor for a long time, since US tea enthusiast circles first came to be back in the early 2000s.  

An example of an established online vendor who blurs this line, with that of an ordinary mixed-types source, might be Seven Cups.  They started as a Wuyishan area main source, and probably retain that focus, but as I recall they were positioned in between the range of curator (selling the best versions at high cost) and an ordinary source (more average quality, selling for less to emphasize value).  This really could be the sweet spot for a lot of people.

Why would you buy tea from them, if you could get better versions for less through Wuyi Origin?  I suppose you wouldn't, if that were true, and you knew about it.  But they would carry more range, and at some point people find sources they like and stop looking.  They don't always want to make it their life's mission to buy the best teas for the best value; they just want to be able to order good tea for good value.  

Most people also aren't going to read 2000 or so word blog post about the subject, which is fine, very understandable.

Where I buy tea (mostly this year, as an example)

I'll use where I've been buying tea as an example, starting with kind of an anomaly.

Rishi / larger outlets:  I only bought two versions from them this year, Thai and Lao sheng versions (pu'er, if that was from Yunnan, but lacking any type name if from South East Asia).  I kept wondering what their versions were like, so finally just ordered some to see (even though they don't represent where I usually buy tea).  They were ok.  They don't hold up well in competition from producer direct sources, but then that's kind of a main running theme here, that you get the best value buying as directly as possible, or from specialized vendors, when possible from sources outside the US.

They would still be fine for buying decent value, higher volume, broad type range, surely better than the average mall outlet that might be nearby.  There aren't that many mall outlets nearby now, since many malls failed in the US, and Teavana folded (was bought by Starbucks, then largely shelved).  

Some of Rishi's other sheng could be better than what I tried; it probably is.  You can't judge a source or a producer from one or two tea versions.  Or a tea type; you see that happen a lot in online discussion, and it just doesn't work.

Wawee Tea / direct Thai sourcing:  oddly I'm not mentioning this as a good option for most readers; they typically wouldn't sell directly outside of Thailand.  But I've just bought really exceptional Thai sheng and black tea from them, and reviewed both here.  

That's a normal, running theme in South East Asian countries; you can buy local versions from very small outlets, or even good sized producers, that wouldn't be readily available / Western facing, through Facebook pages and such.  

Thailand has two online shopping platforms, variations of Amazon or Ebay, in Shopee and Lazada.  Existing small vendors would often sell their teas through there.  There would be even more such sources in Vietnam, another favorite broad origin for me, so let's move on to a Western facing outlet from there next.  I should mention first that 101 Plantation is an example of a main, high volume producer in Thailand, for buying rolled oolong and such, and my favorite Chinatown shop is Jip Eu.  You could buy their teas through Shopee, I think (both of them), but not from abroad.

Viet Sun:  I've bought the most tea from Viet Sun over the past 3 or 4 years, of any source.  They're "Western facing," meaning set up for international shipping, and in the past for credit card payment use, although they mentioned preferring other payment options when I last ordered from them, just a month and a half ago.  Their teas are great.  

Y Ty (Lao Cai) indigenous village produced Viet Sun sheng (reviewed here)

these are so complex that they seem a little different every time I try them

There's a common theme among new, great value, new format vendors that they tend to sell range that's hard to find at great pricing, then later as demand catches up it's more in a normal Western market range.  Their sheng cakes might be priced from $80 to $120 now, or 200 gram versions for half of that; just normal price range, for lots of outlet types.  That would've been $60 to 80 3 or 4 years ago.  Part of that is inflation, and a lot is demand for that supplied tea bumping up.  I doubt that any of it is them increasing their mark-up rate, although that's at least possible.  People find out about types ranges and sources, then demand increases, and costs, starting at producers demanding more.  Usually quality becomes a little more consistent too, so better value is filled in a little on the other end, maybe just not enough to offset higher pricing.

Hatvala had been the earlier more market oriented source I used from Vietnam, and they're still there, and would still be a good source.  That change related in part to me switching to pu'er preference.  They sell some Vietnamese sheng, as maocha (loose versions), but Viet Sun specializes in it, and seeks out a broader range of perhaps more novel offerings.

Back to Thai themes:  Tea Side would be "our" equivalent source.  Their pricing is probably higher than either of these two Vietnamese sources, perhaps related to them leaning into the mark-up a bit more than is the case for those two Vietnamese sources.  As a unique source option whatever they set is the standard market price, because there aren't alternatives.  You have to by sheng for 40 or 50 cents a gram instead of 25 or 30 if there aren't any other options, or just don't buy it.  Maybe it's that limited production at the quality range they sell pushes that same theme "up" a level, and those few higher quality option producers can keep demanding more, as I said was probably now occurring in Vietnam.

Let's check on that, by reference to their pages and offerings.

These are Viet Sun's brand new cake offerings, selling for $45 to 53 for 200 gram versions, so for between just under $90 per standard 357 gram size--which they don't sell--and around $100 on the higher side.  That's actually not bad; that tea is better than just about any Western source version for $100 per standard cake size.

Tea Side's 200 gram cakes are selling for $65 to 85, based on the first four listings, for 32 cents to 42 cents per 100 grams, or $115 to $150 per 357 gram cake quantity.  Is it better than Viet Sun's versions?  I really don't know; it has been awhile since I tried it.  Maybe only equivalent, based on what I last tried however long ago, maybe 5 years back or more.

For someone less concerned about value, about price per gram, and for whom spending a few hundred dollars on tea isn't that much of an expense, then buying a good bit of both teas would make sense, and comparing the two.  It's not like when you order too much fresh green tea, and then a half a year later it's not as good.  Oolongs hold up well to even a couple of years of storage, and sheng changes in ways that are often seen as improvements, as hei cha do.

To me these types of teas evolve well over the first two years, even for styles that aren't favorable for even middle time frame aging, transitioning some over 6 to 8 years.  You can't really buy a 200 gram cake and plan to drink some and then keep some for 20 years, to see a full transition, or at least if you did there wouldn't be much for either consumption purpose.  

I personally wouldn't age these styles of teas anyway (SE Asian sheng, in general).  I tend to only ever experience such teas as 10 or so year old versions, and we can't be sure that the styles from 20 years ago were identical.

Here are some examples of how that has went in practice; reviewing a 2014 Wawee Tea Thai sheng version, and a 2017 version, in 2023, so 6 and 9 year old versions.  Those teas were good, and not really through a more complete 20 to 25 year transition cycle just yet, so it was early to judge them.  This review covers two 2006 Hong Tai Chang versions, reviewed in 2018, with one from Tea Side, so those two were a dozen years old then, just a little further along.  One of those I own a cake of, unless I've got the version wrong, and it's a similar one.  Not so much of it is left now, but I have some I could try as a 20 year old tea.  It's fine, but it would be better if I was more into aged sheng.

I think I'm really referencing three different styles of tea.  The old HTC versions were made by a foreign (Thai) based Chinese producer back then, and Wawee Tea was making their own versions, without direct outside input, back in 2014 to 2017.  The plant material may be the same today, the same exact plants, but we can't be sure that the style is exactly the same.  Presumably they would've only improved processing over time, but there could've been some style shift, to being just different, versus better.  For "better" we need to include "better how," better to drink as new tea or more suitable for 20+ year aging.

Even if someone tries all of these teas just mentioned, as I have, it's difficult to say exactly what you are experiencing is better, worse, or different in style a decade later.  In this writing in 2015 I'm reviewing 2004 Thai "pu'er-style" versions, again from Tea Side, but I can't place how much my own perspective on the same teas has varied in 11 years.  So we make of it what we can.

Unconventional but standard vendor sources:  Tea Mania is the main source that comes to mind related to this (based in Switzerland; that's different).  

That vendor has shared samples with me a couple of times over the last few years, and I've bought more tea from them than from almost any source over the past decade, probably more in total than from Viet Sun.  Not so much recently, because I've been focusing on South East Asian versions and sources.  The styles coming out of Thailand, Vietnam, and Lao have become personal favorites.  Myanmar teas are great too; I've tried a good bit of those, and still own some, some of which has been aging at home for around a decade.

Tea Mania is one of the best sources online, per my judgment, even if only based on their Lucky Bee value oriented Yiwu cakes line.  Their other gushu range versions are more exceptional, of course, but not in terms of value, of quality and pleasantness in relation to prices.  You just can't buy decent Yiwu at low prices.

Tea Mania 2021 Jing Mai and 2022 Yiwu sheng pu'er

Since the main theme here is where I've been buying tea recently I might mention some tea that's in-transit.  I bought a couple of value oriented cakes from Chen Sheng Hao, after reviewing a cool sample set of mini cakes from them a couple of years ago.  Those were higher end, more exceptional teas, but I can't really be buying 50 to 80 cent per gram versions, so this order was about following up on someone commenting online that their lower cost blends are really good.  We'll see; I'll be writing about that a couple of times over the next few weeks.

Some other vendors have been sending me tea that fall into this range.  By "unconventional" I mean outside the normal Yunnan Sourcing / Crimson Lotus / etc., etc. paradigm.  You don't tend to see Chen Sheng Hao mentioned in places like the Reddit r/tea recommended vendors list.  Oriental Leaf, a vendor based in China, sent some exceptional hei cha versions over the past couple of years, novel variations of Fu zhuan or Fu brick teas; they work as another example.  Or Legend of Tea, a Malaysia based vendor, sent some Liu Bao and sheng to review, and they're probably as good a source as any for aged Liu Bao.

Oriental Leaf Fu zhuan hei cha (based on white tea)

     

Atypical naming stands out about one of those sources; the term "oriental" fell out of favor in "the West" about 15 years ago, regarded as pejorative (as negative).  Here in Bangkok they don't keep up with that kind of political correctness; businesses still use that term in business names, and the average person wouldn't be aware of that change.  But then people mostly only use English as a second language, which changes things.

It could seem odd to buy tea from abroad, in other countries than where it is from, from vendors who aren't producer sources.  But it would make sense to, if they could source better tea than standard US or European vendors are selling, and sell it for less than those places.  You would be "getting in on" lower local pricing in other markets, in this case in China and Malaysia.  Shipping would add extra cost, but it costs money to ship within one country, so it's only adding the difference between that and international shipping.  If it's $20 more then buying at volume could offset that, by a lot.

Let's add a reviewed example of that, from one of those sources, from Legend of Tea (out of Malaysia) to make that point clearer:

Legend of Tea 2024 Mengsong sheng pu'er (reviewed in this blog here in 2025)

This tea sells for 118 RM (Malaysian Ringgit), which is equivalent to $29, for a 200 gram cake.  That price looks like a citation mistake, doesn't it?  3 or 4 years ago it would've been more normal.  Their description:

This year's Xiao Ba Wang is sourced from ecological tea trees in the high mountains of Mengsong Da Man Lü, this sheng Pu-erh boasts a fresh, sweet aroma complemented by the distinctive alpine forest fragrance. Its naturally refreshing profile is soft, sweet, and intricately layered, offering a gentle yet rich tea-drinking experience. Each sip reveals a long-lasting sweetness with a refreshing, full-bodied aroma that lingers delightfully.

That's $50-some for a 357 gram amount that sounds like Yunnan Sourcing's higher end $110-120 or so current Impression cakes.  My review notes adds my impression:

#2:  depth and complexity pick up.  Bitterness starts, but that's still moderate.  Mineral undertone is pronounced, of course in a light mineral range, nothing like in Wuyi Yancha or other roasted oolongs.  Flavor seems to include floral tones, and a creamy sort of feel is adjoined by a touch of creamy flavor.  Sounds like oolong range, doesn't it?  But the feel structure of this is sheng, and the included bitterness, even if it's not challenging...

#4:  more of the same; it isn't changing quickly.  Aftertaste and bitterness may both dial up slightly.  Intensity is definitely good, and again the balance and overall effect is nice, the lack of flaws.  Flavor range doesn't extend to anything so interesting, but it comes across as good tea, pleasant and intense.  

I think I'm feeling the effects already... 

So it was pretty good, which I was characterizing as on the basic side, because I'd been drinking a good bit of distinctive, high quality, kind of expensive gushu around then, teas more in the 80 cents a gram range, $150+ for 200 gram cakes instead of $30.  

I've tried that since, and it's pretty good tea, relatively speaking.  It's much, much better than any standard factory tea; maybe two full levels above that.  I mean in relation to Dayi 7542, and also to many others that don't have the external image of being benchmark versions.  For $50-some for a standard size cake it's underpriced by a lot; from just about any other sources it would cost closer to $100, or maybe over that.

What are standard vendor sources then?

This last category description raises a question:  if those are unconventional exceptions, as sources go, what are the most conventional options?

Yunnan Sourcing comes to mind, but that's only a conventional, standard option related to a category, to what I'm calling a market style vendor, one who sells many produce categories and product versions (thousands, in their China based site, and still a lot in their US site).

For pu'er other main vendors are Farmerleaf, White 2 Tea, Crimson Lotus, and Bitterleaf (beyond King Tea Mall and Chawang Shop being good options, again what I'm calling market style vendors).  They would "only" sell a few dozen versions at any given time, a good selection, but limited enough that you could page through it.  

Rishi, which I mentioned, and Adagio are examples of older form, generalist, medium quality, higher volume outlets.  There's nothing wrong with preferring some relatively conventional rolled oolong, or whatever else might seem a bit standard.  People often like some teas as a comfort tea, or to drink with food, and preferences change over time.

To me Teasenz is a good example of a generalist vendor, based out of China, one who sells a little of different things, that is well-regarded and a good value.  Why them, when there are probably 100 relatively similar outlets online?  It's just an example I'm familiar with, and they've put the time in to be somewhat established as a known brand.  I've bought tea from them at least a couple of times, and it was good, nothing too amazing, but good for what it was represented as.  Actually a shai hong pressed cake I bought in 2017 was well beyond that, this tea; they could also find versions that stand out.

Really there aren't standard generalist vendors, typically.  One builds up an image related to a main theme and type range, if at all (like Yunomi for Japanese teas, or those other pu'er vendors already mentioned).  In some cases they grow to be well-regarded standard options, but more often their businesses just succeed, and they do a little better year to year.

Vivek Lochan on status of Indian tea industry

Doke tea images provided by Vivek

After talking with Vivek Lochan recently about how social media group discussion goes, mostly on Facebook, I asked if he could fill in some background on the Indian tea industry in a Q & A form.  These are the kinds of ideas that should come up in online discussion, but it's hard to get starting points to develop to that.  

Most vendors and producers are posting online related to marketing, and tea enthusiasts might just show what they're drinking.  Marketing is fine, and it's interesting hearing about different tea types, or preferences, but it tends to not extend to a deeper level.  

This partly relates to me being the only moderator for a large Facebook tea group, International Tea Talk.  There had been interesting discussions there about a range of themes in the past, but it has shifted to occurring more in other places now, as tends to happen.  Reddit and Discord are active, for example.

For introduction Vivek is from a well-known tea producer family that owns and runs the Doke tea plantation.  His father, a main founder, is Rajiv Lochan, who has been very familiar in specialty tea circles for quite awhile.

This is their Doke website; there is more background there, and it lists some related social media channel contacts.  This blog post works as an intro to that background story.  This is a review in this blog about their Black Fusion flagship product, or one version of it, from back in 2021.

There is always a chance that different people could see different aspects or shifts in local tea industries differently, but to me it's quite interesting to consider thoughts from someone with more local area exposure than almost any of us will ever have, even given that kind of interpretation concern.  

I've discussed local tea industry themes in India quite a bit over the years, most in relation to discussions with Suzana Syiem, a close friend.  We even talked to Rajiv once about related themes, back in 2021 when Covid disruptions made talking to people online seem like a helpful outlet.  Most of this matches and extends what I'd heard before.

Vivek's input on tea industry status in India

How is specialty tea uptake going in India?  Do you see differences in how preferences are changing in other places?

Specialty tea is slowing increasing in demand and interest with customer across the country. People are willing to experiment more and with better buying power, they can easily afford to try more than once. The increase in availability of teas with flavours – natural like fruits and herbs or like mocktails kind of stuff – also helps attracting a newer audience of tea lovers who can’t necessarily be called tea lovers.

Specialty tea quality development often seems to relate to two different factors, to small, private producers developing a more artisan approach to making tea, and to experimentation and development by larger producers.  Is one of these inputs having the most impact, or others?

I think the abundance of small, private producers is having more impact. The larger producer is usually under economic pressure to produce more and sell more. The smaller producer usually doesn’t have as much pressure and is more open to experimentation to set himself apart from the crowd. 

These small growers sometimes mimic styles from other countries / areas but that is only apparent to a person who is well versed with teas from foreign nations. Most people are appreciative of efforts to partially ‘copy’ production styles while keeping the end result unique. Something like our Black Fusion from Doke seems to be well appreciated. 

Black Fusion, from that earlier review

In different places different approaches to promote awareness seem to work, eg. public tastings, or media articles.  What seems to make a difference there, and what doesn’t work?

Media articles, semi private tasting sessions, food pairings and free sample distributions seems to be working quite well. We are trying to get more hotels involved with setting up tea tasting and food pairing sessions so we can attract more people to the tea world. Larger public tastings don’t seem to work because then it can be difficult to engage with people. Engagement is important to have both the drinker and the brewer understand what each other are looking for - kind of like wine tasting sessions. 

Are cultivars in use continually evolving?  Can you add a bit about that?

The TRA is always working to introduce new cultivars or better the current crop of cultivars available [the Tea Research Association, a government run institution under the Tea Board of India]. They have certainly come a very long way in the past decade or so in making the tea crops more pest / insect resistant and sturdier against drought. Constant evolvement of the cultivars is very important.

I seem to recall mention of a specially designed sprinkler system doubling as irrigation and offsetting high temperature impact on tea plants at Doke.  Is that accurate?  Can you describe this more?

Yes – we have a new government sponsored irrigation system at Doke which has been working wonders for us for the past couple of years. Upkeep has been a little bit expensive at the beginning with sprinklers failing and pipes bursting but overall, it has been a great addition. The new sprinkler system has all its piping underground, so they are permanently placed unlike the old system which needed everything moved as and when required. Set up time and wastage is almost nil now. 

The older sprinklers had a larger coverage area per sprinkler with a stronger throw while the new system relies on smaller sprinklers creating an almost mist like situation. This results in better absorption of water in the leaves and in the ground. The sprinklers are situated according to a design generated by a computer program that takes into account terrain features like trees and elevation changes.

Are changes related to climate change impacting tea production?

Climate change has very severely impacted tea production throughout the country this year. A dry winter coupled with a very hot and dry summer had decreased growth very sharply up till May. The situation started getting better end May onwards with some rain showers. June and July has been much better with constant rain and some sunshine in between. The tea bushes are still under stress due to almost 6 months of rain deficiency, but the situation seems to be improving. 

How many flushes or harvest periods can you harvest from tea plants?

In North India, the tea season usually starts in March and ends in November end. Old hands like to say that it starts with the Holi Festival and ends with the Diwali Festival. This is true as both festivals are based on the lunar calendar. When either festival goes up or down in the date range, the tea harvest season seems to follow. Of course it is not an exact science but has been pretty accurate.

Can you add some description of background on major plantations in Darjeeling transferring from family ownership to corporate ownership?  Is this a concern for continuity of Darjeeling tea production?

Almost all the tea gardens in Darjeeling today are corporate owned with a head office in Siliguri or Kolkata and a managerial team at the garden itself. The only family owned and family run tea garden in Darjeeling today is Giddapahar. Both brothers look after all the aspects of the tea estate directly without employing any manager level employees. They make it seem easy to sustain a tea garden in the current economic situation but I know that it is anything but!

What factors are changing the local tea industry there most, among new themes like sustainability, fair trade, and safety (related to pesticide use and testing)?

The Food Safety Authority of India has recently highlighted the pesticide use but that is a very difficult situation to tackle. The Tea Board regulates what pesticides can be used in tea gardens and the dosage as well. A blanket ban is not possible as some pesticides banned by the Tea Board are allowed in other fields. Pesticide use also cannot be checked regularly at the field level. Soil testing takes time and labs are not very common. Made tea testing can be expensive and not every lot can be tested. People are becoming more aware about these things.

Are public sales platforms like Amazon—different variations of that—changing the tea sales landscape in India?

Amazon and other online platforms are certainly extremely helpful to market teas and find retail customers. We are seeing more and more of our customers moving online even if it is just to have an online presence. People are willing to purchase online and can find a wider range online compared to physical stores. 

What potential changes or developments could best improve the lives of tea plantation workers?

The biggest change would be to increase the wages of the workers, but the producer is barely able to make ends meet at the moment anyway. The consumer, the middleman, the wholesale buyer is certainly not interested at all in increasing their prices or reducing their margins. The tea gardens already provide subsidized rations, medical facilities and housing facilities but those can be a bit basic sometimes. The government could do more to help –  most of their programs don’t seem to be able to reach the right people.

Assam green and silver needle teas

 

Not long ago I reviewed an exceptional quality version of Assam whole-leaf black tea, sent by a producer friend Maddhurjya to enjoy and to review.  These were sent with it, a green and silver needle version.  They look amazing, and they should be amazing.

As with the first post I'll keep the back-story here to a minimum.  Maddhurjya started working on exploring better quality tea production, new types of processing and equipment use, and organic tea production quite a number of years ago.  He might've been somewhat new to it when we first met, something like a half dozen years ago, but he was making quite good tea then, and it has only improved since.  There's more on him and that project is on FB and Instagram.

It's now on a level with better teas from anywhere else.  The highest end Chinese teas tend to draw on an older and more developed tea tradition, with the absolute best tea versions the result of many decades of tea growing and processing, or really centuries, so the absolute highest quality Chinese teas tend to have an edge on others from elsewhere, but that matters more for some tea types.  Black and green teas are more basic in general style (as I see it), and white (the silver needle) is the least processed broad type, so it might vary a little less.  Differences related to terroir and plant type issues might stand out more than processing being dialed into optimum for these.  But we'll see.

I haven't been drinking much green or white tea for years, but many cycles of trying many teas from a lot of different areas over a decade give me confidence that my judgment will be reasonably informed.  Related to brewing process I'll go with a Gongfu approach, and a pretty high proportion, as is normal for me.  Brewing water temperature might be a little high, possibly around 90, or maybe down into the mid to upper 80s as a thermos I'm using sheds some heat, which is probably not optimum for the green tea version.  But I'm a sheng pu'er drinker, so if it includes a little extra astringency edge, extra mineral base, or if a heavier vegetal tone stands out a little I'll be fine.  It would be sweeter and lighter brewed 10 degrees cooler, which I'll probably be able to comment on a little as I go.

I should mention that some people consider silver needle a certain style of white buds-only tea, and often silver tips is used as a more general term.  Silver needle is often used for the English derived name for a Fuding, Fujian tea version, based on plant type and growing conditions that result in a larger bud form.  I don't even get caught up in naming issues people far more often consider important or restricted, like pu'er (although I do respect the registered Yunnan-origin only convention by awkwardly calling other versions "pu'er-like), or Oriental Beauty, which isn't registered to describe only Taiwanese teas.  I don't have any conclusively grounded opinion on whether this is truly silver needle or instead should be called silver tips, but I'm pretty sure that silver needle is closer to the Oriental Beauty example, not a registered and restricted naming convention, so I think it's fine.

Review:

green tea:  I brewed this round a bit fast, not trying to compensate for the tea needing time to become soaked, instead going with a first light introductory round instead.  Range is pleasant so far, light and sweet.  This tea could have far less of an astringency issue related to being in a mostly whole leaf form.  Umami already stands out, even though the tea is brewed quite light.  I'll save adding a flavor list for next round.

silver needle:  a lot of mineral base stands out in this; interesting.  Often buds-only white teas can be subtle to the point of not tasting like much, with some vague floral sweetness coming across.  That's not how this is.  Sweetness is still pronounced, and there's plenty of floral range there, but at least right away a mineral base stands out most.  It reminds me of how Nepal white teas often strike an amazing complex balance, including all that I've mentioned, and maybe even a bit of citrus.  For people familiar with good Nepal white tea that's clearly very high praise.  This should be interesting.

green tea, second infusion:  I brewed this more like 20 seconds, if anything perhaps slightly over optimum, but it will avoid another comment about these needing another round to get started.  Umami, underlying mineral, and heavier flavor range really stand out in this.  I think it's already to the point where using nearly 90 C water is pulling flavor range to a heavier, less bright and sweet range.  I'll cool the next round to experiment on that, mixing in just a little room temperature water (not sciencey, or optimum, but it'll work).  Floral tone is a main input, along with umami, and from there heavier vegetable range stands out.  It's hard to place, non-distinct, maybe as close to cooked okra as anything else.  I'll keep working on a more detailed flavor list.

silver needle:  warmth, sweetness, and depth really bumped up in this tea.  It's not really that close to Nepal white, which is lighter in form, with flinty mineral, light floral, towards a light citrus edge; that was only similar to the early round profile, it seems.  A much warmer range of floral tone and citrus both really kick in, but it's more like a warmer orchid scent than a lighter version of that, and more like a tangerine than a sweet and light orange.  Rich feel rounds out the experience; for still developing this has a lot going on.  There's even a hint of drier edge, relating either to oxidation input or to a natural mineral flavor tone (feel and flavor ranges tend to naturally couple in standard ways).

green tea, third infusion:  cooling the water (mixing it) did shift results a little, but not too much.  Heavier mineral and vegetal flavors still stand out, along with sweetness, and rich floral range.  I brewed this for a bit under 10 seconds; infusion strength is fine for both even brewed fast.  I won't pin down floral or mineral range much, which are hard to describe, but I will attempt to say more about the vegetal range.  There's a grass aspect to it, but it's complex, and not mostly that.  Vegetable range could be fairly close to okra still.  That gets odd because it's not a heavy, cooked vegetable flavor, but who is familiar with eating raw okra?  It seems like what is happening relates to a lot of range combining.  Rich and lighter floral tones seem to mix, along with a lot of mineral base, grass, some vegetable, and some holy basil spice range.  It's intense, but it's pleasant for being such a clean effect, with decent balance.

I've mentioned many times that green tea isn't my absolute favorite range, which I suppose could seem odd given that I drink mostly young or slightly aged sheng pu'er, which is closest to that.  I don't hate the entire flavor profile range, I just don't like the straight-grass effect, or more one dimensional vegetable flavor inputs.  Sheng often tastes floral, and essentially never like grass or vegetables, although characteristic astringency and mineral base can overlap with some green tea range, and unusual pine-like aspect can enter in (which I just noticed in a Jing Mai version two days ago).  For this green tea being complex, generally positive, and balanced I like it.  I'd probably like a sheng version that's this high in quality and distinctive better, but that's how type preferences and acclimation works.

silver needle:  this is richer, sweeter, heavier on rich floral tones and warm citrus fruit, and thicker in feel.  I think this would naturally appeal to a broader range of people; there is no conflict with aspect preference range to get in the way, it's just good.  It's definitely not subtle or wispy.  This was even brewed for 10 seconds or less; pushing it would draw out even more intensity, although lighter flavor balance would give way to heavier range if you did that, to some extent.  I should push the next round a little to check on that, since I've just brewed these quite light.  It will be more of a test of the green tea; I don't think that you could easily ruin this tea with brewing variations.

green tea, fourth infusion:  I cooled the water even more by mixing one third room temperature version; this will be brewed quite cool, maybe even under a 70 C relative optimum (160 F or below).  Ordinarily that would impact intensity, but I've let these brew for more like 20 seconds, probably just under that.

It's lighter and sweeter, for sure, with feel range not diminishing at all, or the heavy mineral base flavors.  Interesting!  If someone absolutely wanted to keep the heavy grass and vegetal range in check this is the way, use fairly cool water, maybe even dropping slightly below 70 C.  I'd probably see using 75 to 80 C as an optimum, and might even go with 85, accepting some heavier flavors that I don't love as much as a trade-off for bumping intensity way up, even brewed fast.  Sweet floral tone does come across well in this round, with an even stronger mineral base, so it's not overly light, but for being a sheng pu'er drinker I'm accustomed to intensity, which sticks around even with fast and light infusions.

silver needle:  not changed, really; the last description still works.  Heavy floral tone might be bumping up as the sweet citrus drops off, but it's still similar.  I'll probably do one more round to check on changes, back to brewing the green tea hot, and leave off taking notes.  These teas are not half finished yet though; cutting off writing is about keeping this length moderate, and about later transitions not being as interesting to me as describing the basic character of the teas.

green tea, fifth infusion:  the heavier flavors punch is back, related to using quite hot water again.  I suppose it's nice that the flavor can be that dialed into different ranges like that, if one likes.  Other tea types tend to not work out like that; you can shift the range of experience, but not necessarily the basic flavor profile.  The grass and vegetable might seem a bit much to some but to me it's balanced well enough with heavy mineral base, umami, and equally pronounced floral range input.  I like that feel structure too; it has an edge to it, brewed hot and somewhat intense, but again I'm familiar with teas including intense feel along with intense flavors.  

In discussing what I like about sheng with a Yunnan producer friend he guessed that people might just adjust to liking a little more complexity and intensity, then a little more again, until they need a lot of both to get their fix.  Oolongs are plenty complex and interesting, with full feel, but once you follow that pattern it might not be enough, since they tend to give up both--related to sheng--in exchange for exhibiting refinement and flavor aspect range that's a more natural fit to ordinary, unconditioned preference.  Bitterness alone is a big part of that (which of course I've not mentioned in relation to this green tea; they tend to not be bitter).  People new to drinking beer would probably love a mild amber more and then later on IPA and pilsner can somehow seem more appealing. 

It's interesting the bag it came in has a common type of orchid on the front, and the "flavour of Assam" branding.  There is plenty of floral range in both these teas.  This seems to be transitioning more to green beans in later rounds, so there's other range too, but it works better for it all balancing.

silver needle:  not transitioning too much, but a little.  The gradual, subtle drift towards warmer floral tones might be leading into a light spice-like range now.  For this tea being so approachable, while still being complex and intense, you could try out pushing it with full boiling point brewing water and see what that changes.  

It might work as an optimum to start cooler, maybe in an 85 C range, and then keep bumping temperature as intensity fades just a little.  This is still plenty intense, and you can add more to that just by lengthening brewing time, but drawing out warmer tones and a touch more astringency could be good--in the form of feel depth at this lighter level--as the tea softens further and narrows in flavor range.  At five infusions in it's far from fading away, so I'm talking here about messing around to experience change and an optimum.  Or it's great like this, or surely brewed hotter; this is the opposite case of when I'm describing how one might get a decent but mediocre tea to give up a bit more intensity, more about how one might try out a finer level adjustment of brewing process just to highlight what is already present.

Conclusion:

I liked the silver needle more; that really stood out for complexity, intensity, and flavors being in a very positive range.  I liked the green tea more than I like an average good-quality green tea version, and if I was a green tea drinker this would all be framed in completely different context, much more positively.  It's a green tea version that a sheng pu'er drinker could appreciate, but they would still probably like sheng pu'er of equivalent good quality even more.  Drifting off the subject a little, I tend to like sheng versions that seemed to have been heated a bit too much, spoiling a lot of the long term aging potential, and shifting the aspect range, but they can be nice as very young / new versions.

It's interesting considering if these were better than I expected, or different in any way.  I thought that they would be quite good, so that matches.  This white tea intensity was a pleasant surprise; fine bud content white tea can be intense, as this was, but often that comes with negative or neutral aspect range trade-off, for example the mineral tone not integrating as well as this did, or giving up brighter floral and fruit range.  You usually don't get that kind of balance across a range in white teas; it's either mostly a very pleasant sweet and floral high end, or a deeper base joins much less of that.  That's why Nepal white teas really stand out, but they often express a brighter, lighter-tone range, light floral, and bright citrus, not the warm and deeper range.

Probably I'll come to love this green tea more as I try it a few more times, and automatically dial in brewing better, versus messing with it round to round.  To me green and black teas can tend to be more basic in range expressed, which can still work out as a positive experience, in a way that can work really well drank along with food.  I still drink sheng with breakfast almost every day, or black tea, oolong, or shu if I feel like it, but that's not really about setting up an optimum pairing.  I eat plain foods, breakfast cereal, toast, or fruit, and the sheng is often out of balance related to intensity, even brewed light.  I probably should buy more black tea than I tend to, but I often end up reaching for sheng anyway.  It'll be nice to have a couple more options to mix in, while I have these teas.

Specialty whole-leaf Assam from Maddhurjya

Maddhurjya Gogoi, a tea producing friend in Assam, recently sent me some tea to try and review.  It's been awhile since I've tried Assam on this level, or any Assam, really.  I've been through a few cycles of checking out teas from there, so the range is familiar, but I've been mostly on sheng pu'er for a number of years now.  I've already tried this tea, before tasting it to write review notes, so I know how it works out; it's pretty good, as I would've expected.

I met Maddhurjya on a visit here once before; he's such a nice guy.  Their tea production theme and philosophy is a familiar one, moving to create much better quality, organically produced teas from plants that were producing more ordinary versions earlier on.  They've been at it awhile, allowing time for experimenting with different processing techniques, changing processing equipment use (much earlier on), or even changing plant type inputs.  We didn't discuss all that again; this will just be about the tea.

Maddhurjya is second from right, beside Kittichai, the Jip Eu shop owner

The packaging mentions a number of branding and company names; it's described as Lu Ma Whole Leaf Assam Orthodox, Hand Crafted Black Tea, from MG TE, produced by Chah Bari, operated by Gogoi and Sons, under Assam Teehaus.  The last one is familiar.  They're in Dabohibil Village (Assam, of course).

In the past their tea versions have held their own against any other highest quality Assam I've tried.  Next one might wonder about placing that in relation to Darjeeling, or Chinese teas, or from elsewhere.  Assam is interesting and novel for including a variation of maltiness that comes across much differently in whole-leaf, higher quality versions than in relatively ground leaf tea forms.  The astringency drops out almost completely, reduced to a fullness of mouthfeel effect, so that flavor input stands alone more, combined with better sweetness and other range.  Flavors tend to include dried fruit along with a mineral undertone base.

I've still not covered if the quality level or general appeal can match that of good black tea elsewhere.  Style and aspect variations stand out more than quality level, which varies within any kinds of categories.  To me it's fair to either associate or separate whole-leaf tea production from other quality inputs, depending on what you mean, how you want to use that umbrella term (quality).  Broken leaf tea tends to not be as good as whole leaf versions, although there would be plenty of exceptions to that on both ends, just amazing broken or cut up leaf tea (like most tea from Japan, for example), or plenty of whole leaf versions that just aren't that good. 

Beyond that, comparing like for like, more whole leaf versions from Assam versus Darjeeling, China, Taiwan, Thailand, or wherever else, quality can vary, but in general aspects shift by local plant type, growing conditions, and processing inputs, more than some from a location tends to be better or worse (as represented by the best versions, of course).  Darjeeling doesn't express the same flavor range, or as much intensity (at least in one sense), but refined and very pronounced fruit flavors with good sweetness can stand out more.  Nepal teas can be fantastic in a different way, maybe a little closer to Darjeeling in character, but also just their own thing.

This tea description will help place all that.  I'll brew it Gongfu style, which is a normal approach for me for higher quality, whole leaf black teas.  Water is not far off boiling, and proportion higher than most people would use, probably 7 grams for a 100 ml gaiwan, brewing in less water than that, since that measurement tends to relate to the volume to the top, not how much you use.

Review:

First infusion:  malt hits you first; the usual.  Of course it's a soft and mild version of malt, not the type with a bit of edge, that seems to somehow pair with the astringency.  The depth of this tea is nice, the way layers of aspects combine to provide a really complex experience.  Warm mineral tones seem to support it as a base, but there is range one might interpret as either aromatic tropical wood or spice.  Mind you this tea is just getting started; it's not even fully wetted yet.

Fruit isn't as pronounced, at least yet, but one part tastes a little like dried tamarind.  Even though this first round is brewed a little light the feel is already rich and full, and aftertaste lingers on.  It's hard to describe why that matters in tea experience; how it supports a more complete experience.  The tea drinking experience can seem more limited without those extra dimensions, as a quick flash of a few positive flavors, versus an experience of more depth, when they're present (fuller feel and aftertaste).

I just reviewed two Chinese oolong versions, presented as being two different quality levels by the vendor, or at least that was implied in a cost difference.  A Tie Guan Yin version didn't include any more aftertaste experience than this, even though usually that's more noteworthy in that range of oolongs than in good Indian black teas, and then the other, a Dan Cong, compared more favorably.  

some color difference is from inconsistent camera settings, which I'm not editing to correct

Second infusion:  depth picks up, which wasn't exactly a limitation that first round.  What I'm describing as warm mineral tones, working as a base, combined with dark tropical wood or spice range, similarly more a context background than forward element, really needs even more unpacking, but I'm not sure if I can add a list of extra descriptions or concepts to help with that.  It's interesting how really good Darjeeling can seem to dazzle you with a complex range of pronounced, higher end fruit and floral tones, with pleasant deeper range supporting and balancing that, along with great sweetness, and then this is the opposite; the depth itself stands out.  The higher end might be drifting some to a warm dried citrus peel aspect, with dried tamarind fruit still present, but not overly pronounced.  Then that deeper range is more complex and intense.

I hadn't really thought of all this in those terms before but this may relate to what I love so much about Dian Hong, Yunnan black tea, that it covers both ranges equally.  Some versions can have a nice forward aspect, with less base, and it's more common for others to include a lot of warmer, deeper structure, mineral tones, mild and deep fruit elements, earthy range, etc., missing balance in what I'm describing spatially as a high end.  But often it just balances.  The different flavor range of roasted yam, roasted sweet potato, cacao, and mild spice is well suited for expression as pronounced aspects and deeper tones.

Back to this version, it's not unbalanced, because sweetness and lighter flavors are also present.  But one more cacao element, a touch of raisin, or a little extra other fruit or spice would balance it to expressing forward notes just as much as depth.  Often the more forward aspects can fade while depth picks up over rounds; it will be interesting to see how this changes in relation to that, if the deeper tones really dominate more later, or if the opposite somehow occurs.

third infusion:  the more forward flavor aspects transitioning round to round offsets some of the pattern I'm describing here, the depth standing out more.  There is still a faint edge of warm dried citrus in this, and more that relates to something like dried tamarind (more to place that range; it might differ slightly from that), but more of an autumn leaf tone is picking up, a sweetness and richness across an unusual vegetal range, that's really in between fruit and vegetal ranges.

Permit me a tangent about fallen leaves; the scent of tropical tree and plant leaves is much different than the range of those I experienced living in places like Pennsylvania and Colorado.  PA had deep and rich, very complex, tree vegetation range, so the fragrance of walking in the woods in the fall, or even spring and summer, was very layered and complex.  It's drier and less heavily forested in the high mountains in Colorado, so more spice-like, subtle, lighter fallen leaf scents would stand out.  Since you adjust to the scent range you happen to be in, just as your eyes can relate equally well to a broad range of light levels, to some extent all this would become transparent, just the intensity range you're within just then.  

The tropics are something else.  Vegetation has a sweeter, more floral oriented scent range.  It gives up the depth of a heavier, richer PA forest tone, and doesn't settle on the same lighter, almost spice-like range of CO forests, but in one sense fragrance is much more pronounced.  Sweeping the leaves in the driveway almost makes you want to brew that and try it out.  Some of that is from a range of types of flowers thriving at different times, or aromatic components of trees covering more range.  Back in Hawaii that tied to seed pods seemingly related to tamarind or other fruits, but here in Bangkok the gardens at the house grow dozens of kinds of plants, papaya, banana, lime, and mango, flowering vines, palms, basil, and so on.  

The depth of this tea ties to all that; in a sense it might be a mix of layers of tones that comes across as a base due to the diversity, since it's not that 3 or 4 of those stands out to seem more forward.

fourth infusion:  I brewed this a little lighter, not varying infusion time to see how results vary, but it did work out like that.  Brewed light the lighter flavors stand out more, and the warmer depth is less pronounced.  I think this is more in line with how a lot of people brew most Chinese teas, to try to be clear.  Intensity is still fine, but it would be easy for someone acclimated to mild black tea to like theirs brewed stronger.  

Getting back to a flavor-list approach a round later might help keep this reading length in check, and describe transition patterns better.  I'll get back to a 20-some second infusion time next round, brewing it on the stronger side again, since that works better as an experiential optimum for me.

fifth infusion:  fruit range seemed to shift the most.  What had been dried tamarind with some dried citrus peel might have transitioned a little towards plum.  Of course heavier flavors picked up too, from increasing brewed strength, back to warm mineral tone standing out.  

I'm not mentioning malt so much, for starting out by saying that's the main flavor aspect, right?  It's there too, but it settles into more of a mid-range background context; all the rest stands out in relation to malt.  Malt in CTC Assam seems to link to very dry flavor and astringent feel range, to astringency experience, and that's not present in that form here, since this has good feel structure but not that kind of edge.  Here it's a little more like malted milk ball range, or the malt that gets added to a milkshake (not often enough; I miss that from my childhood), or in Ovaltine.  That blends in better than the stronger and harsher variation; it's easier to almost miss it as one part that integrates with the rest.

sixth infusion:  probably a good place to leave off; this is long enough, and it won't be as interesting a story how this fades over the next half dozen rounds.  For brewing it strong it won't make it far past a dozen infusions.  The more forward, higher end range is definitely not dropping out; there is plenty of fruit left in this, and other more vague but complex aromatic range.  

Conclusions:

This is a really solid, high quality tea.  In terms of a general quality level I don't think this is giving up much to other black teas anywhere.  Flavor range and other character is different, varying naturally along with a range of inputs, but it's "as good" as any other black tea I've tried.  

That's a real accomplishment; it can drop into the background as a natural outcome, that of course any tea can be really good.  But so many inputs had to be controlled to go just right for that to happen.  The tea plants themselves, growing conditions, processing choices, processing equipment used, storage conditions; it all had to go really well.  Weather had to contribute positively; it's not as if all the conditions were something producers can control.  Maddhurjya and his family did a great job.

There is always going to be one more version out there that's distinctive in some other way, or finer and finer quality level steps to climb.  I'm not trying to say that this is the best possible orthodox Assam that could reach the market.  It's pretty far up the scale; interesting, distinctive, balanced, and refined, lacking any noticeable flaws.  

Sometimes I'll mention that pricing relates to the assumed quality level, that teas can be presented as one thing or another, like a Tie Guan Yin oolong version being sold as upper medium range, or a Dan Cong oolong selling as a similar thing, implied as better since the standard type quality range doesn't match directly, the scale of typical offerings.  I don't keep up with how higher quality Assam maps out, or how many alternatives would be anything like this, or some even better (there always is more range).  I suspect that awareness and demand for teas anything like this in both Indian and international markets is still limited, with the same being true in very different senses for Darjeeling, better Nepal versions, good Chinese black tea, and so on.  For whatever reason sheng pu'er awareness and demand "blew up," just in a very limited sense, and oolongs have always been a favorite category of many.  

Someday maybe specialty tea will have its moment, or maybe it will always be a niche interest.  Either way in the meantime this is a good example of what most people are missing out on.  That's too bad but not so bad, given how good Darjeeling and Chinese black teas, and the rest, all are in their own ways.

the last time I saw these guys, just a few days ago, with more separation to follow

Gopaldhara Red Thunder ruby and black autumn Darjeeling

Red Thunder Ruby left, black right

About winter / fall teas from Gopaldhara, not versions I've kept around for as long as some other recent "lost sample" posts, but definitely running one season behind since it's onto spring already, maybe just not time for Darjeeling first flush releases yet.  This is one of my overall favorite teas from Gopaldhara, and to me one of the best Darjeeling versions I've tried.  The review description sheds light on why, it just isn't really filled with subjective take input like that, more about aspects, so it really wouldn't come across. 

I think the other version is a black tea variation that may be experimental, or something they made for limited batch sales.  I didn't see it on their website.  Either one, since their original India version has been joined by one set up for foreign sales, listing Red Thunder here (assuming there is one main version that this is, which the "Ruby" designation potentially may not relate to):

Gopaldhara Red Thunder Oolong – Winter Frosted 2021

Gopaldhara Red Thunder is a limited edition Darjeeling Autumn Flush made from frosted leaves. This fine tea is made from clonal bushes and appears blackish red with abundant tips. The tea is made during the last week of October where the temperature starts approaching zero degrees at night, leading to the leaves getting frosted. Extreme cold weather conditions at high elevation induce a special and complex flavor into the tea. It is well oxidized while still retaining a prominent fruity flavor.

I'm usually a bit skeptical of teas being marketed as Indian oolong, since the versions never remind me of the rest of the range of teas presented that way, from lots of other countries, but this has a distinctive and different character.  Or I suppose autumn flush might tend to be like this, since I've not tried so many of those?  Anyway, it's really good and novel in type, and oxidized to a medium level, so oolong it is.

That tea lists for $10 for 100 grams; that seems really low to me.  I just mentioned a couple of teas from Nepal selling for $15 for 50 grams last post (the second used to benchmark value for the first), and for teas as good as Jun Chiyabari usually makes that seems fair.  I can't imagine those could be better than this though, just different in style, and it's listing for one third that rate.  Direct sales has the potential to relate to much better value than teas sold by a middleman or two in between, but often all kinds of vendors will build up demand and customer base by starting out with a low markup, and correct that later on.  I'm not necessarily saying that I expect this price to double over the next few years but that wouldn't be unusual. 

Review:

Red Thunder Ruby:  fantastic, of course, but the point here is to pin down in what sense.  Even for being slightly light due to being a quick first infusion this is great, complex, well-balanced, and pleasant.  Warm tones complement nice warm fruit range, complex enough that it's not just one thing.  Interpretations of dried black cherry and tamarind might make sense.  There's a bit of citrus edge but not so much, at least not yet.  The warm tones aren't as clearly defined and distinct, but it's pretty much in lighter black tea range, even though I think this gets described as an oolong.  

More oxidized oolong range always overlaps with less oxidized black tea range anyway, often accompanied by percentage amounts, like 80% oxidized, but it's hard to be sure that specific designation is meaningful.  A tea being just off fully oxidized does mean something specific, just maybe not narrowing that down to a percentage.

Black Red Thunder:  an early sourness throws off this coming across as positively, but it seems like the kind of flavor input that will "burn off" over the first round or two.  Warmth and sweetness matches the other for this, and there's probably some fruit range to it too, but for being light mostly that sour note comes across.  It seems a little like sour cherry for combining those ranges, maybe just pulled a little towards cocoa, as the other also was.  In going back and trying the other that warm range could be lots of different things, spice, or aromatic wood, but it's not as clearly centered on cocoa.  It will be interesting to see how both shift once they're really along the main infusion cycle next round.

Ruby Red Thunder, second infusion:  a little tartness picks up in this, giving it more of a berry character.  It's not sour cherry, but not so far off that.  It's nice how complex this is, how it packs in a lot of fruit range, with warmth complementing that.  I'm not sure the tartness is really an improvement, and trying to brew this on the lighter side may lighten the balance of that.  I was using about a 10-15 second infusion time, more towards 15, which doesn't sound like long but as usual I've maxed out the proportion.  

The warm tone is moving in an interesting direction, now heavier into spice, between cinnamon and warm tree bark range.  Cinnamon kind of is bark; I mean like a typical thick barked hardwood, but related to cured bark, a version that's been stored somewhat humid for awhile, perhaps laying in the woods.

Black:  the sourness did mostly drop out in this, with an unusual mineral range filling in.  It tastes a little like salt; it's odd that doesn't come up more.  It gives it an interesting sweet versus savory divide, like sweet and sour pork, or crispy pork (kind of Chinese / general Asian thing).  A rich fruit range develops, more like cherry than anything else.  It's cool that these have expressed so much range around the cherry theme so far, with the other venturing into other berry just now.  

The feel of this has a dry edge to it.  That's not really good or bad, a positive supporting input or something that detracts, just how it is.  If it was stronger it would be negative, and I suppose rich and full without dryness might be slightly better, but it's fine, it's nice.  

Red Thunder Ruby, third infusion:  a little extra light, but it's nice "seeing it" from different infusion strength perspectives to get a feel for how the experienced aspects range can vary.  That one catchy set of fruit and warm tones still stands out, with feel relatively positive, with some richness and fullness but no real edge of any kind.  There is no sourness or tartness in it prepared this way.  Complexity stands out most, how there's a lot going on.  The fruit and warm tone ranges aren't just one thing, as I've described, both really coming across as a set of flavors.  That spice / bark tone starts to transition more to aromatic, warm wood tone, or that could just be an effect from shifting infusion strength.

Red Thunder Black:  the best this has been, even though this is a little light (how it's prepared).  That unusual mineral range is cool.  It doesn't come across as much as salt this round, but it's definitely a main part of the experience.  It leans a little towards that inky mineral effect that can be present in roasted Wuyi Yancha versions, which really does taste a bit like ink smells.  A more conventional interpretation would discuss wood tones or fruit more, since those are easier to notice, but the mineral range stands out (to me) for being novel, and contributing a lot to the overall effect.  Fruit range never did dial up quite as much as in the other version.

I'll be traveling today so I'll probably do one more round with note taking and then drop this, probably not getting back to adding more about the later rounds.  Both will keep shifting and developing, and both are pretty far from finished, as I've prepared them.  Drinking two teas worth of 8 or 9 rounds in a hurry is too much; made this way it's too much for someone to drink straight through.  

I never really factor in context like that when starting, in part due to not being all that clear-minded in the morning to factor in anything.  It's 9:30 AM now and already hot out, and I started this back more towards 9, a more proper time for getting out of bed on a Saturday.  A single Tim Horton's maple cream filled donut is offsetting the impact of all this tannin in my stomach; so far so good, but it's at its limit.

Ruby Red Thunder:  really nice, very well balanced, but I don't have much to add about changes.  If anything it all just evened out nicely, with fruit and warm tones, and rich feel, all coming together in their proper places.  I would accept this as a nice black tea version, the feel is just a bit softer, rich instead of having any astringency edge at all.  It can be considered an oolong then, it's just not like any form of Chinese oolong, as close as any to a Taiwanese rolled ball form "red oolong," kind of an unusual sub-category.  

The richness in this is a bit like that warm tone in a cinnamon roll, not just the cinnamon part, which is present, but also that nice cooked sugar range, and warm pastry effect.  Don Mei would go crazy listing flavors for this; it would contain 20.  It comes across as complex but integrated, and in a unique sense as simple.  It's good.

Red Thunder Black:  a lot of that general commentary applies to this too; it's integrating nicely.  The warm tones definitely include a bit of a cured wood effect now, which works with the rest.  Mineral has backed off a little, letting that part and fruit show through.  Either of these could be interpreted as more into citrus range than I've described, maybe with a hint of sweet red grapefruit in this overall effect.  Both are complex enough that a lot of different interpretations could make sense.  These reviews are more about describing an overall effect built up through describing how details add up, but not as one objectively correct interpretation.  Seeing these flavors as being something else would be natural, and not necessarily less accurate.  

All in all this is pretty good too.  I liked the other better, for really nailing a unique balance, more the version I expect from past experiences (not that I can memorize a tea so well from one year to the next, or across two).  I thought this would contain more edge for being identified as a black but it really didn't include much more for astringency / structure than the other, with that early dryness dropping out a round ago.  The oxidation level difference is almost clearer in the wet leaf color than the character, since they're just different, not necessarily with this just like conventional black tea and the other not.

Conclusions:

Not much to add really; both were nice, but to me the Ruby version really stood out.  Expectation could've factored in, it being more what I thought I would experience, or what I had learned to appreciate in the past.

I often find myself saying that I like teas or that they're good in posts, since I wouldn't usually review a tea that I don't like, which is a less interesting story to tell.  It's hard to put that on a scale.  Gopaldhara tea range is really novel, up there with the absolute best I've tried from India, and this version is one of my favorites from them.  It's on the exceptional side of "good."  

I like their lighter intense fruit and floral range teas too, when versions really click, but this one also has consistency on its side, that it's always this good, and seemingly always in a similar character range.  That impressive, given that they need to work around how much the weather cooperates in making teas.

back from that travel I mentioned, which included snorkeling in the Gulf of Thailand

there were no other people or boats anywhere near us that day, kind of crazy